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Post by magnumwheelman on Aug 2, 2017 15:35:32 GMT -5
Well... we have a delay... we're not happy with the bullet sizes... buddy has cast about 100 bullets with 2 lots of wheel weight alloys, and bullet bodies are consistently at .481, & the heel at .455 ( mold specs are bodies at .478 + or - .002, & Heel at .454 + or - .002 which I think is what they were after with the original Achilles project ) this with clip on wheel weight alloy... body is .001 bigger that their max, heel is within spec... this is why we only ordered single cavity aluminum molds... we're going to try ordering another that is supposed to cast a .476 body & .452 heel... once we get the sizes we're looking for, I don't have an issue ordering a multi cavity mold in the correct size... buddy ordered & has received a red lube that has like a 173* flow temp... I'm still planning on trying the powder coat method when we get there
is there an "average" thickness added to the bullet diameter from powder coating???
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JSilva
.30 Stingray
Posts: 184
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Post by JSilva on Aug 8, 2017 5:42:54 GMT -5
My powder coating adds .0015" to .002" to the diameter of my bullets. I'm using the cheaparoo Harbor Freight Red.
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Post by cherokeetracker on Aug 8, 2017 7:25:09 GMT -5
Mag, I figure about .002 for an all around thickness. It sometimes varies just a little. When coating the bullets you will have to determine to get an even coat that does not have buildup.
Now this is just a thought... and I do not know just how much time or trouble you want to devote to this. But I have had quite a bit of experience with Powder coat for years before doing anything with bullets. In doing Motorcycle parts I used to use a cap to cover the threads. This ( rubber or plastic )compound was such that it could take the heat when the items were baked. My main use, was to cover the threads on smaller parts. My thinking was if you wanted, you could cover the heel of the bullet and not create any other obstacle to deal with. The heel would still be exposed lead and the rest of the bullet would be your powder coated item. I am not sure at this point ( If you had to Size the bullet ) if there would be any distortion with this particular type of bullet. I would think that if you needed to size the bullet then place the heel end in first, and the ram would be on the bullet face ( thinking a Lee Sizing die). Otherwise the possibility would be to make a sleeve over the heel part and use this against the ram, to provide support and keep the heel round. You did mention the cast bullets being oversized and I would play with some of these to see what happens so I would be ahead of the game if you decide to make another Mold. You could size them or powder coat them and test your results to see tolerances. If the lead rolls over the heel when sized then let it set for a week or two and then it should harden enough that it could be placed in a collet type chuck and turned or cleaned up on a lathe. As Daddy always said,,,, Where there's a will there's usually an in-law.
Charles
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Post by magnumwheelman on Aug 8, 2017 8:56:38 GMT -5
since the bullet is a wide flat nose, we thought about sizing them upside down, if need... also buddy was looking at a set of collets to size the bullet & the heel, but if it were up to me, which in the 1st place is a lot of work for bullet prep, & I'd like the bullets to come out the correct size, so that a PC gets me the diameter I'm looking for... was going to add a little more to this thread the other day, but without pics I wasn't sure how many were following we did some experiments casting last Saturday... we mic'd the mold block when cold, & then when up to enough temp to get good bullets & there was .010" growth in the mold block... using drill rod, we were seeing .003" growth in the bullet size in the mold... we're thinking that this was the original cut for the 480 Achilles mold, but we chose aluminum blocks, & the original may have been steel??? we noticed bullet diameter grew .003" between cold molds & hot molds so we've redesigned the mold ( which Accurate allows on their website )... added a crimp groove at the top of the heel, & changed the dimensions to get us what we are looking for with the mold hot... ( I'm liking the addition of the crimp groove, & dropping the sizes to allow for powder coating without sizing )... been busy at work, but need to get the drawing to Accurate to start getting another mold cut ( only one this time, so we can make sure we're perfect, before we order another mold ) your guys information on the thicknesses has been a big help... BTW... I've never done the powder coating, but back in my ATV race days I worked with a shop in northern Iowa that did a lot of coating for me, that I got to witness the whole process, & they used a high temp plastic tape or film to protect areas they didn't want coated... I'm thinking I want the heel coated, so that I don't have exposed lead that could lead to leading???
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Post by magnumwheelman on Aug 8, 2017 14:07:37 GMT -5
a little more precise update... ( consider these number more accurate than those in my previous post, as I had my notes with, while composing this e-mail ) this is the e-mail I sent off to accurate molds with a couple educated guesses... ... now we're also thinking about how to mark the dies, ( & perhaps the barrels of the guns ) which are currently under construction ( if you go back to the beginning, the building of the collet crimp dies was what my buddy was excited about in the 1st place ) we are thinking of a name, since this is no closer to the 480 Achilles, than the Hornady 45-70 Leverevolution case is to proper case dimensions some random thoughts... my buddy thought 476 AL, or 476 WW ( we're both from Albert Lea, MN... & both our last names start with "W" )... my 1st though was 476 Long Colt... I know that is sure to get someones dander up but since we are building on Rugers, we can use the full length 45 Colt case, no trimming needed... any other suggestions???
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Post by cherokeetracker on Aug 8, 2017 19:26:59 GMT -5
How about 476 W2 ? the w2 is for the 2 last names starting with W The 476 AL is not bad at all but too many people would think Ackley Long or something other Have fun with it.
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Post by magnumwheelman on Aug 9, 2017 9:36:20 GMT -5
I ordered another mold from Accurate this morning that is supposed to throw .476" bullets with .452" heels with a crimp groove at the top of the heel... should have that to try in a week or two... collet crimp dies are still being made... if this diameter of bullet works out well for powder coating, when I order mine, I may remove the lube grooves & make this a PC only bullet design... & we still need a name for the cartridge
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cmh
.401 Bobcat
Posts: 3,745
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Post by cmh on Aug 9, 2017 10:13:11 GMT -5
476 Special.......
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Post by magnumwheelman on Aug 9, 2017 10:18:34 GMT -5
wouldn't want it confused with the 475 Special that there are guns being built right now... hmmm... maybe 476 Eley Long or for short 476 EL
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cmh
.401 Bobcat
Posts: 3,745
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Post by cmh on Aug 9, 2017 13:52:55 GMT -5
476-45 Express.......
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Post by magnumwheelman on Aug 9, 2017 14:35:20 GMT -5
that one sounds interesting
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Post by magnumwheelman on Aug 10, 2017 10:34:55 GMT -5
I think I'm getting this new picture hosting thing figured out... the newest bullet mold with crimp groove on the heel... if this is all the right sizes, the next one will be mine ( this will be buddys that he's going to try the harder red lube listed back a ways ) next one may not have lube grooves, & be specifically for powder coating
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cmh
.401 Bobcat
Posts: 3,745
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Post by cmh on Aug 10, 2017 10:57:24 GMT -5
Im enjoying your project 😁
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Post by magnumwheelman on Aug 10, 2017 11:05:16 GMT -5
I had a strange thought this morning when I found the 480 lever action for sale on GB, that I put in the links section... hmmm... wonder if this cartridge could be chambered in a 45 Colt lever action with no changes but the barrel??? since the bullet is roughly the same diameter as the case, the magazine tube & lifter mechanism should all be fine... might cut the cost, & add availability & possible brands of a 475 caliber lever action significantly... & with the powder coated bullet, no issues with the original outside lubricated bullet... & using full length 45 Colt cases the power lever should be a significant improvement over the original 480 Achilles project, built on Colts BTW... I hadn't been taking many pictures, with the issues with "bucket" so I'll get some fresh stuff coming... I'm way behind on the 25 ACP target barrel project... the 476 there isn't much to see yet
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cmh
.401 Bobcat
Posts: 3,745
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Post by cmh on Aug 10, 2017 12:32:15 GMT -5
Dont know why it wouldnt work..... may or may not have to rework the lift block. That and the barrel.... 😉😁
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