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Post by CraigC on Aug 22, 2009 9:48:51 GMT -5
Nature of the business, get over it. It's the nature of the business to get over confident and treat your potential customers like dogs? Please, get a clue. I went from being one of the very few that even knew who John Linebaugh was, much less conversing with him, to one of hundreds in Ross Seyfried's 1986 article. There you go with more of your elder statesman rhetoric, we all know different buddy. Gary Reeder had a frame I want: a Stainless, 1.6" .510 Maximum, his BMF...... I want that Freedom Arms quality frame and cylinder, and Reeder had that. Don't know another smith that did, or does. You're really comparing Reeder's guns to FA??? You've never handled one, huh? Oh, and make no mistake: Dennis, a bunch of those folks I know, and, they would be GREAT additions to this forum , to balance out your axe grinding... I agree, I've thought several times about sending DennisM an email to invite him to join us here. When that cockiness comes out of ignorance, only believed by the fellow ignorant, who's impressed??? Sorry sir, but I don't deal with cocky. Cocky blowhards have deeper issues. You have to admit the irony. CC, you give me a really bad time about saying anything even in the slightest about John Linebaugh, and, follow me around to different forums, and cross post to this one. I was waiting for this. I gave you a hard time for being a two faced liar. For throwing John under the bus in one thread and then singing his praises in another. Then, I ask for some other opinions, because you have an axe to grind with Gary Reeder, and, you object, because you can't give up your axe, even though your stalking me, which you admit in a PM, for saying anything true though not the best light, about John Linebaugh... Stalking? No, you're just upset that I found YOUR link to THIS thread on Gary's board. YOU took this discussion to another board, I'm just the one that found it. Why? Because every time there is a heated discussion about Reeder somebody goes crying to his board. This time, that somebody was you. As I said before, I really don't have an axe to grind and I urge you to go back and read my first post. I simply related my experiences with him and YOU objected. It's the continual defending of my own position to folks like you who make excuses for pitiful behavior that make me look frothy. Because at the end of the day, discussions like this do absolutely nothing for me.
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Post by whitworth on Aug 22, 2009 10:07:56 GMT -5
Yep,...that did it. I just threw up,.... And I just threw up twice...... ;D 510, you're confusing me a bit. I don't understand where you are taking this. If Reeder is building 400 guns per year, he has got a production line going and his attention to detail will never be that of a Bowen, Linebaugh, Huntington, etc. It's a physical impossibility. As Craig pointed out, what does he care if he pisses a few people off?
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Len
.30 Stingray
Posts: 358
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Post by Len on Aug 22, 2009 10:45:54 GMT -5
This is probably I hope my last post on this subject.
510, Craig is correct you have kept this thread going by challenging and putting a twist on every observation or negative experience shared on this thread all in defense of Reeder. The funny thing is you may unintentionally be doing him more harm by dragging this issue out and exposing more people to the various issues.
Reeder states he has no knowledge of my problem, 510 says it’s probably Hornady’s fault. I started digging in my old notes and I have found an Email that I kept as it also contained load data. The email was an exchange between myself and Reeder it was all very cordial and in it I made Reeder aware of the brass sizing problem and he responded to it by asking me to mike bullets and if they are of correct diameter to see if the die would crimp them so they do not move. He went on to say that he would exchange dies. We went on to exchange dies this did not help and in a later phone conversation he told me in a very disturbed tone as he was OBVIOULY getting tired of discussing this problem that I “should rely on just the crimp”! At this point because of his agitated attitude I realized I was getting no where and made a decision to get the problem corrected on my own. If there is a question about the existence of this email making Reeder aware of the problem I can and will scan it and post it along with any others that I might find on the subject.
I have no idea who made what or who was at fault BUT I purchased everything through Reeder he ultimately should have dealt with the problem not blown me off with obviously bad advise. 510 states that I have no financial loss this is not true as after I started shooting the gun I had quality issues I paid another gun smith to fix as I had no intentions of going back to Reeder. The die and or case problem made the gun useless for about 2 months as the original die was with Hornady and it took awhile to research the problem and make a new die.
I have no issue with Reeder being brought into this as he was party to the problem. As for all of these other gunsmiths and writers that love him am I wrong but isn’t he one of the few gunsmiths not mentioned in Bowen’s book? But the obvious answer is that he picks and chooses who he abuses!
510, regarding Reeder’s Africa experience which is of no relevance in this matter. I have been going to multiple countries in Africa since 1980 I have killed more animals that most Americans I have been involved in major culls and on many occasions spending 4 to 6 weeks on the ground. But this does not make me cocky and it definitely does not make me an expert on handguns.
Reeder sucks if you want to use his services go for it you can twist and turn this any way you want but that is my opinion and I am sticking with it!
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raven5
.240 Incinerator
Posts: 73
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Post by raven5 on Aug 22, 2009 11:18:17 GMT -5
A few observations: I disagree with the statement that one's experiences with 'smiths shouldn't be posted on this board. Completely disagree. That is the point of this board I believe. Should we also refrain from posting factory problems as well? What then? We'll only be reading posts about how great the factory offerings are, etc. No negative feedback allowed. It seems to me that a poster on here was very defensive of Huntington as well. Absurdly so. Not comparing him to Reeder by any means. Wouldn't do that to the guy. Just an observation that seems to me that someone has a dog in the race or something. I'd say comparing Reeder's work to a FA is just a joke. Even Bowen states that after everything he can do to a Ruger, which to anyone who has seen one can attest is phenomenal, it is still just a Ruger. If you want Freedom Arms quality and strength, go with Freedom Arms. End of story. This from maybe the top smith in the world. It seems to me that defending Reeder has become a fulltime job.... It also seems that Reeder has more complaints about him that probably all the other big bore revolver 'smiths combined. I've conversed with several of them and they couldn't have been more of a gentleman. I do remember emailing Reeder a time or two about some things and got the impression that he is an ass. I asked if he could countersink the case heads and I got a rant you wouldn't believe, something to the effect that any smith worth a thing wouldn't do it. He wouldn't do a barrel band because that was Linebaugh's signature and that was that. He also professed his bluing was considered by all those in the biz to be the best in the country. That was my the end of my dealings with him. I truly believe that he makes gaudy looking guns with quality that isn't really any better than factory, maybe even less in some cases. I also believe that his BS reasons for not doing some work is simply because he can't and nothing else. I will state that in dealings with Bowen, Clements, Harton, etc. that for certain things I wanted they have at times directed me to one of the others; but no one has ever recommended Reeder. I think that speaks volumes.....
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Post by AxeHandle on Aug 22, 2009 12:22:01 GMT -5
Dang guys.... Now that we are all warmed up and have worked through that storming, forming, and norming phases of team building..... I have one of the Reeder 1 of 100 Number 5 Improved 44s on the way... This is the first series that was done on a stainless 3 screw cylinder frame... I understand that Reeder used Ruger 3 screw conversion parts in it! Ya'll going to be ready to provide a good critique?
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Shakey
.327 Meteor
Central Arkansas
Posts: 543
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Post by Shakey on Aug 22, 2009 12:33:54 GMT -5
Gentlemen,
I consider myself a guest here on Lee's forum and would not presume to be entitled to decide what should or should not be discussed or who should stay or go. Such decisions lie solely with our host who has plainly stated that he does not like making such decisions.
I will not tell another guest to shut up but I do ask that you consider whether adding another point to your argument is worth the aggravation and embarrassment to our host, particularly now that it has been spread to other forums.
The posts to date speak for themselves and all concerned have plenty of information to draw their own conclusions. I feel the need myself to express my outrage at some of the comments made but am doing my best to refrain. If you feel that you simply must continue this 'discussion', I ask you to please review you post and consider how you think Lee will feel about it before submitting it.
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Post by ruger1280 on Aug 22, 2009 12:40:32 GMT -5
I own 3 Reeders.
I recieved great service and followup. ALL of them are extremely accurate and reliable.
Reloading for them is standard for any other types of wildcats. All have performed at or exceeded performance claims.
They have been every bit as accurate and reliable as any of the other smiths guns. I have yet to find a gun that will outshoot them.
For true field guns(which is all I really have), fit and finish is very good.
Any questions I have had have been answered promptly and completely. No problems and no hassles.
I'm truly sorry some of you have not had the same experience as I have had.
Dave
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Post by foxtrapper on Aug 22, 2009 20:10:13 GMT -5
I have been dealing with Gary Reeder for over three years . He has built a rifle and three revolvers for me. The guns are beautiful, well built and shoot great. I would recommend to all. I have not met the man[ maybe one day on one of his hunts] but never had a problem speaking by phone or written correspondence with him. All I have to say is if your interested in one of his guns give him a call and make up your own mind.
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Post by cache44 on Aug 22, 2009 22:12:17 GMT -5
Because of the degenerate nature of this forum I was the one who contacted Gary not 510Max. I own a Reeder and love it. I just placed an order for 2 more. One a T&A 455GNR.
I also don't like people hiding behind handles. Flame me in PM if you want but keep it off public boards.
Lee.. I'm surprised you let this go on so long.
Bob Denning
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Post by CraigC on Aug 22, 2009 23:43:03 GMT -5
I think it's my turn to barf. Out of one corner of your mouth, you participate in this thread strictly to stir up trouble. Before now, I've never even heard you mention Reeder. Now you're his new #1 Asskisser??? Huntington too busy for you these days? Out of the other corner, you pretend to be the philosophical type (Socrates???) with a grander purpose with your rhetoric about human rights, gunrights and religiousness. What a friggin' crock! You're a fraud and you're a child and everybody can see it.
I gave Gary every chance and was far more patient with him and his antics than I should've been. In the end, the BS was more than I could take. Everything I've stated in this thread was the God's honest truth. Gary treated me like garbage as well as several others. It has not a thing to do with hurt feelings. It has everything to do with reaping what you sow. If I can't ask a gunsmith about returning parts without getting my head bitten off, I'm taking my money elsewhere. I will certainly not, and have not, toured every internet message board ranting about Reeder but if anyone asks for an opinion on him or his work, I feel obligated to share mine. You can choose to disregard my anecdotes if you please, as can anyone else but don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining.
Just remember that this thread would have never gone this far if folks hadn't repeatedly made excuses for his piss-poor, childish behavior. You'll fit right in with his crowd of true-believers.
PS, I think it's worthy of note that Reeder just stated that he does NOT install a bearing block against the bolt on all his 5-shot conversions. Not saying that it's good or bad but a noteworthy detail if you're shopping for a custom big bore. Don't make your decision based on price alone. As has been stated previously, there are several steps that most `smiths take on their guns that Reeder does not.
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Post by the priest on Aug 23, 2009 1:41:38 GMT -5
Because of the degenerate nature of this forum I was the one who contacted Gary not 510Max. I own a Reeder and love it. I just placed an order for 2 more. One a T&A 455GNR. I also don't like people hiding behind handles. Flame me in PM if you want but keep it off public boards. Lee.. I'm surprised you let this go on so long. Bob Denning Sir, Most here like facts. If you had contacted Reeder and he had something to add,....I'm sure most would have been happy to listen to his side of the story. So,....I think you have ZERO risk of being flamed. As far as hiding behind handles, your pal 510 max uses a handle as do most on the net, such as yourself. I'm pretty sure if I shared my name with you it wouldn't matter in the least and I'm sure CraigC,...who had a legitimate gripe with reeder would be happy to do so if you really felt the need to check records. One thing you're probably not aware of is your pal Max's propensity to cause ridiculous, overblown, overinflated, self serving arguements just like this one. Just like the one he fueled only one month ago,....with the same results. he shoots off his mouth and then deletes all of his posts so he can't look bad or he's had a change of heart. pretty cowardly. you'll also notice he edits almost every post in these situations. This has been going on for,.....oh,.....about ten years or so? Although the last pompous, blowhard rally he just had with himself was logged and will be reposted for all to see. To be clear,.....this is not about Reeder. It started as notes from Reeder that are always worth the read. It then went to problems,....then to Max's self serving soap box,..per the norm. I'm sure his person attacks are soon to follow. You see it runs the same continual course,.....
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rigby
.327 Meteor
Posts: 769
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Post by rigby on Aug 23, 2009 10:00:53 GMT -5
I already hate myself for posting in this thread again but..... I'm feeling very strong about the contention that there should not be any open complaining about any gunsmith. Isn't that one of the main points of this board? To give an honest opinion of what we experience with our purchase. Whether it be a factory or custom. Anyone who will take solely the word of one person on a forum my loose out, but when there is a more then a few with the same complaints there maybe some fire to go with that smoke.
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Post by CraigC on Aug 23, 2009 10:07:18 GMT -5
Thanks to priest for saving the deleted post.
I feel I must apologize to the group for my behavior. What one must understand is that I've been biting my tongue on this for ten or twelve years going back to the original Sixgunner board. This ain't about old grudges, it's about knowing the truth about somebody who ain't what he pretends to be. When Greg started his nonsense in the thread with the little girl and Fermin, I was at the point where I had to either bite it off or let it out.......I let it out........I let it ALL out. In doing so, I let Greg bait me into a heated discussion about Reeder that I did not want to get into and for that, I am sorry. This is not the image I wanted portrayed of this group...at all.
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Len
.30 Stingray
Posts: 358
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Post by Len on Aug 23, 2009 10:59:06 GMT -5
All I wanted to do was post my experience and opinion one post should have been all that was required.
Others could and have posted their experiences both positive and negative and without someone who was not involved in the issue 2nd guessing or putting some spin on what may have happened.
I would have no issue with someone who was part of the actual transaction voicing their side.
Len
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Post by majorKAP on Aug 23, 2009 13:32:51 GMT -5
So wrote Theodore Roosevelt.
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