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Post by sixshot on Jul 8, 2021 23:12:41 GMT -5
Thanks Bob, I've got plenty of molds, maybe too many! I think in any caliber a person can "over" bullet his gun. I'm not exactly sure where that weight is but I know that sooner or later recoil can pull any bullet, just like I mentioned in another post recently. Bob Baker was telling me about a guy that insisted on shooting extremely heavy bullets in his 454 & he paid the ultimate price...his life. Case tension & crimp can only do so many cycles of the gun with massive, heavy bullets & you can get bullet pull at the wrong time. This guy did & died with ammo in the cylinder & bite marks on his gun.
Just my opinion but in the 41 magnum I think even a 270 gr bullet is sitting on the fence of being a little bit too much of a good thing. Maybe go with a bit lighter bullet & less recoil, just maybe. Always good to share opinions on these sorts of things. Extra heavy bullets can have draw backs, agree or no?
Dick
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Post by rjm52 on Jul 9, 2021 5:58:00 GMT -5
"This guy did & died with ammo in the cylinder & bite marks on his gun."...!!!...YIKES!!! I think you are right however... 255 is as much as one needs in a .41. Garry Reeder and his customers who shoot .41 have put the Cast Performance 255s through bison and African buffalo... ..and yes, I am "over-molded" when it comes to .41....  |
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Post by bearskinner on Jul 9, 2021 8:06:11 GMT -5
Dick, I think there is a diminishing point of return, going too heavy with bullet weight. Too heavy, and there’s less speed, loosing penetration. Too light and they fly super fast, but are too light to adequately penetrate. It’s finding that happy medium, accuracy, impact and penetration. That’s also part of the fun of developing a load ( to me at least) I also have many “go to” loads that seem to be the perfect combo of both, and work well all the time. Another thing, all my revolvers and single shots, look pretty much the same, and feel the same, even though they are different calibers.
Your hold feel right in multiple calibers. Guess I’m just a creature of habit, but it works for me. Finding the load and gun combo for different hunts adds to the excitement of preparation.
All that being said, I have a few guns that always seem to get the nod on a hunt, or as the back up.
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Post by bula on Jul 9, 2021 8:49:31 GMT -5
All that gopher bopping is gonna pay off ! Yes, also believe there is a point of diminishing returns for penetration. Think that 45 Colt 405gr Garrett loading is right out there at the ragged edge ! I'd say in 44mag this sweet spot is 270-300grs. A bit more in a hot loaded RH or similar ? I gave a range rather than one weight, too early to be arguing. Hey Sixshot ? When is this trip ?
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Post by sixshot on Jul 9, 2021 9:16:50 GMT -5
Paid our deposit yesterday, booking flights today as I drive to Kennewick, Washington to see my brother. It's looking like August 18th, but won't know until later today.
I know I've but the 230 gr Keith completely through elk & also the 250 gr LBT 41 bullet, and I've never been concerned about bullet pull until I heard that story from Bob Baker a few weeks ago in his office. Kind of made me think. I think in some cases in could be old brass with 2 many crimp cycles also, just a thought.
Dick
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Post by dougader on Jul 9, 2021 10:31:37 GMT -5
Guy in Alaska was attacked by a 9' grizzly while walking his dog. Heard a twig snap, looked over and here comes the train! Dog ran away, guy fired his 454 Ruger Alaskan from the hip. His 5th shot brained the bear.... 6th shot had pulled crimp and revolver was effectively locked up.
I checked my 335 WLNGC's in 454... an Alaska fishing sidearm. Ran the test/6th cartridge through three 5-shot rotations to check for bullet pull. None. Check. Rounds good to go.
I love that 255 grain LBT bullet in 41. Robb gave me a few to try.
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Post by rjm52 on Jul 10, 2021 7:20:55 GMT -5
Many years ago I got a bunch of the 255s in a trade with Kelly Brost...have about three boxes of loaded ammo left. Have been running them with 22.0 grains of H110 for right around 1400 fps from a 5.5". Have shot them mainly in a 6" FA and the custom Gary Reeder. Very accurate out to 800 yards...
Don't know why the new owner of CP dropped that bullet. The Accurate Molds 41-250L is very close in design.
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Post by bigmuddy on Jul 11, 2021 10:41:03 GMT -5
For me, “bullet pull” has been more of an issue in the 454 Casull than in any other cartridge I’ve used. For me it hasn’t taken extreme bullet weight for the problem to arise. One example was with 335 LFN design bullets. I had one from Cast Performance and another from a different company. The bullets look identical but the “other” brand was harder. Same loads, same brass, same expander and crimp, and the CP bullets held tight. The other brand creeped forward with each shot until #5 had the gun tied up.
I’m sure bullet weight is a factor when bullets creep from their case. I believe the snappy quick recoil in the 454 is as much of a factor as heavy weight. Bullet hardness may also figure in as well.
Bottom line, I think we all agree any load needs thorough testing with all components identical before we venture out into the field, especially when the gun may have to be relied upon as a life saver.
Dan
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Post by bearskinner on Jul 11, 2021 11:02:10 GMT -5
Bottom line, I think we all agree any load needs thorough testing with all components identical before we venture out into the field, especially when the gun may have to be relied upon as a life saver. Dan Not to mention when you are supremely confident with your gun/ load it takes that little bit of concern away, and clears your mind to concentrate on target acquisition. It’s a good feeling when starting your day hunting. |
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Post by 45MAN on Jul 11, 2021 20:47:27 GMT -5
GUYS MAY COMPLAIN ABOUT ONLY BEING ABLE TO LOAD 4 IN A 5 SHOT 454 FA REVOLVER BUT I NEVER CONSIDERED IT A PROBLEM, NOR HAD A PROBLEM BECAUSE OF IT, AND IT GIVES YOU A LITTLE BULLET PULL SAFETY MARGIN. ON THE 10 SAFARIS WHERE 454/45COLT MODEL 83's WERE MY PRIMARY HUNTING GUNS I ALWAYS MONITORED BULLET PULL VERY CLOSELY.
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Post by x101airborne on Jul 12, 2021 8:50:52 GMT -5
Yall aint kidding about bullet pull in the 454. Seems no matter what I do, that 5th bullet will slip at least a little. I have bought crimp dies, cannelure tools, etc. and no matter what, by the time that 5th round has had 8 rounds of recoil my bullet has slipped at least a little. I wonder if it may or may not be how I handle recoil of the weapon. I know I dont have fists of steel and it has as much bark as it does bite. Even using Max's (for lack of a better name) "overlap" grip style, I know if I am not paying attention I am going to be sorry. My loads are no where near max pressure / velocity for the 454. I am still trying to work up to it.
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Post by sixshot on Jul 12, 2021 11:38:11 GMT -5
Dougader, I agree, that 250-255 gr bullet in the 41 magnum just seems right for some reason. And they penetrate with that long shank, I really like them. And Dan I think you're onto something with the quick, snappy recoil of the 454 & bullet pull. Not saying it can't happen with other calibers because it does but I can see we're all on the same page, maybe that's experience talking.
Did I happen to mention it's a long way to Kennewick, Washington, Yikes! Got home at midnight last night from visiting my ailing brother, and that trip over the Blues is tiring! Took a few photo's of Durkee when we went through & thought I heard Elmer & Harold Croft up on the hillside, shooting at old log cabins!
When we got home there was a brand new book from friend John Taffin sitting on the counter, even at midnight I had to open it up and read for an hour before I went to bed, thanks John, it's terrific!!
Dick
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Post by paul105 on Jul 13, 2021 20:21:45 GMT -5
Dick, hope the current upheaval in South Africa doesn't cause you any problems!
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Post by rjm52 on Jul 14, 2021 5:45:00 GMT -5
Dick, hope the current upheaval in South Africa doesn't cause you any problems! ...my thoughts exacctly... SA on a "good" day is none too safe...lately it seems there are no "good" days. |
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Post by dougader on Jul 14, 2021 10:14:55 GMT -5
From time to time I watch the reports of SA farmers being attacked, tortured and killed. It's an epidemic. "Eyes peeled" is the motto!
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