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Post by taffin on Apr 16, 2020 12:31:27 GMT -5
Bullseye has killed more guns than Hillary has people. [/quote]
Think about what you have said! This is the same kind of logic anti-gunners use when they blame the gun. Bullseye has never "killed" a gun. The misuse of this powder and other powders has destroyed firearms, however it was not the powder it was the human misuse of this powder which cause the disaster.
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Post by junebug on Apr 16, 2020 13:04:09 GMT -5
The hottest load i'v found is in the Fifth Edition Hornady book. It shows 4.0 to 5.5 grs of Bullseye and a 240 gr lead bullet for 800 fps. I don't use Bullseye for any of my loads just personnel preference. I like a large volume powder for my loading.
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dmize
.401 Bobcat
Posts: 2,825
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Post by dmize on Apr 16, 2020 13:49:01 GMT -5
Bullseye has killed more guns than Hillary has people. Think about what you have said! This is the same kind of logic anti-gunners use when they blame the gun. Bullseye has never "killed" a gun. The misuse of this powder and other powders has destroyed firearms, however it was not the powder it was the human misuse of this powder which cause the disaster.[/quote] My sincerest apologies for my poorly worded attempt at sarcasm and humor.
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Post by webber on Apr 16, 2020 14:05:55 GMT -5
There is always someone on every forum like me. Could that 6.5 grain BE have been used in balloon head cases hence the 6.5 grains since the balloon head cases have more volume? Also great shooting but was it something he could do on a consistent basis? Could he have thought it was super great and he saved the card for that purpose or was it one of many he had that he displayed the same degree of accuracy on? Most of us keep our very best targets and quickly trash our bad ones. Before anyone jumps on me as a Keith basher nothing could be further from the truth. I am a Keith fan of unbelieveable proportions, was and always will be, but he was still human. We all know about humans don't we? I try to stay grounded in reality. I have done some very good shooting and some very poor shooting as have all shooters everywhere.
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Post by taffin on Apr 16, 2020 14:45:39 GMT -5
Could that 6.5 grain BE have been used in balloon head cases hence the 6.5 grains since the balloon head cases have more volume?
This is exactly what everyone is ignoring/forgetting and also why old loading should never be used. Until the early 1950s .44 Special brass was of the balloon head variety which definitely held more powder. When the solid head brass arrived powder charges were reduced. In fact Keith himself went from 18.5 grains of #2400 as his standard load to 17.0 grain of #2400 for his Heavy .44 Special Loads. Keith also was not the only one using Bullseye for heavy loads in the .44 Special. A look at the Loading Manual from the .44 Associates shows the following: 240 Grain Bond/6.0 grains; 245 grain #429352/6.3 grains; 246 Factory RN Lead/6.5 grains. In the February 1953 American Rifleman we find the same thing. The Lyman #429251RN is listed with 6.0 grains while the 246 grain Factory RN Lead is at 6.5 grains. All of these loads are in BALLOON HEAD BRASS.
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Post by bula on Apr 16, 2020 14:58:17 GMT -5
Aahh...wiser heads have prevailed. I should have known better, NOT including myself as a wiser head. Thank You John Taffin.
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Post by boolitdesigner on Apr 16, 2020 15:49:36 GMT -5
Elmer shot that in his #5, which I've seen along with that playing card target next to it. I had a good conversation with Ted Keith about it at a NRA convention in St. Louis quite some time ago now. Wish I could go back now.........................
Back when I could see better and was still young, I could duplicate that target with several handguns, wheelguns and single actions. Would be afraid to try it now though.
The 44 Special is a really good target gun. Try 4.0 grains of Bullseye under a Lyman or BRP 429383 cast of 50% WW / 50% pure sized 0.431" in a S&W 624 6.5" barrel. It will produce incredibly small groups.
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Post by ddixie884 on Apr 16, 2020 16:57:23 GMT -5
I enjoyed the Hillary comment and considered it to be an inside joke among friends. Probably not for public consumption. Not as a statement of facts. I apologize for being crass.........
I'm also not surprised that Mr. Keith was using the current acknowledged max load of BE for shooting a group for display...
All JMHO-YMMV.........
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Post by Cholla on Apr 16, 2020 16:58:09 GMT -5
That 6.5 gr. load would have definitely been loaded in balloon head cases.
I pointed out the load not because I'm a fear-monger or Keith basher, but only because it appeared that no one else had noticed the load.
Without going in to detail, I will say that a several years ago I inadvertently loaded significantly more Bullseye than we're discussing here under a 250 gr. cast SWC, and fired a couple through one of my .44 Specials before that light came on and that little voice said "Something's not right here." Neither the revolver or I were hurt in the least.
So perhaps the load Mr. Keith was using wasn't all death and doom after all.
Cholla
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Post by drycreek on Apr 16, 2020 17:20:07 GMT -5
I'll try this when possible, but I might not post the results, I'll probably need a whole piece of paper... Yeah......naw, y’all ain’t seeing my groups until I have a lucky accident.
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Post by sixshot on Apr 16, 2020 17:48:45 GMT -5
Trust me, you are one heck of a shooter if you can do that for 5 shots standing at 10 yds. Think lottery here!! Shooting a tiny group is one thing but shooting the center out of the Ace of Spades is on a whole different planet.
Dick
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cheth
.240 Incinerator
Posts: 60
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Post by cheth on Apr 16, 2020 18:10:24 GMT -5
If someone had a balloon head case that could measure the weight of a case full of water I'd run the QuickLoad on it with a 429421 @ 250 grains and 6.5 grains of modern Bullseye.
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Post by flattopdan on Apr 17, 2020 9:38:17 GMT -5
To me it almost looks like keith placed each bullet so it would nip at the edge of the spade so as to completely eliminate the center. It could have been one of those one in a million groups but I would suspect not. I think Keith practiced everyday.
Lots of good groups posted and it looks like plenty that are equal or better. I’ll give it another try next week.
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Post by reconciler on Apr 17, 2020 11:17:19 GMT -5
I tried.
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Post by lockhart on Apr 17, 2020 12:25:15 GMT -5
Tyrone, there was a time I could do that at 25 yds with your gun but I was sitting, I think he was shooting off hand. I know Bob can do it, just shove any 41 in his hand & get out of the way! Some very nice shooting gents, I'm impressed. I wouldn't be surprised if Stan doesn't have some itty bitty targets as well. Dick
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