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Post by potatojudge on Jan 7, 2023 12:27:23 GMT -5
My 44 mag Contender carbine has accidentally become one of my most hunted rifles. 16 or 18 inch MGM barrel, fixed Zeiss 4x (might be 6x), and uses the same load as my FA83 so I keep a lot of that ammo on hand. Kicks a bit but not something I'd complain about, and not nearly as bad as my 45 Colt Low Wall.
It's light, handy, very short, has a good trigger, and is accurate. Rides in a racquetball case. Too convenient to leave behind some days when the rifle next to it is a foot longer and 3 pounds heavier.
If there was a good 44 mag pump action option, I'd probably carry that instead.
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Post by habanero on Jan 7, 2023 14:00:51 GMT -5
If I’m not mistake a European member here makes custom Contender barrels. Definitely something to consider. Thank you all for the help so far. I’ll go back and read it several times.
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Post by needsmostuff on Jan 7, 2023 17:35:46 GMT -5
Being in Europe you probably could great access to the CVA Hunter in 44 . Made in Spain I believe. Under $300 when you find one here. It's a well-made utility break open single shot.
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jeffh
.375 Atomic
Posts: 1,730
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Post by jeffh on Jan 7, 2023 18:59:18 GMT -5
Just input, not bashing/trashing: I had a Marlin 94 in 44 Mag and it was not fun to shoot. The SBH was easy - could shoot it all afternoon. The Marlin beat me up with the same loads, but I do have several bad discs in my cervical vertebrae. The 77/357 (did not have a 44) was the single most disappointing and aggravating gun I've ever owned. I could get off a second shot with a Handi much faster, as the bolt was VERY stiff and very difficult to cycle from the shoulder. Accuracy was just OK. Did a lot of work to it and made it better but I'd never go through that again. The stock was a total loss and when I hit Ruger up for help, I never got a reply, until after I sold the little pig. That was not on Ruger so much as an individual who apparently wasn't following up on e-mails and Ruger called me a year later and explained and asked if they could help. The plastic stock crowded the barrel, so I relieved it a bit. Next thing ya know, it was crowding it again. I opened that barrel channel several times and the stock just kept bending to the right. I wasn't going to spend money on an aftermarket stock after what the gun had cost me. "Synthetic" stocks are noted for being stable, but this one was like a Lowe's 2x4 in how much it continued to react. I explained all this to the guy who bought it but all he cared was whether he could "hit a deer at fifty yards with it," using store-bought ammo. Never had a Rossi 92 in 44 Mag, but I did in 357 Mag and it was one handy little gun, accurate and shot almost anything (except 200 grain bullets) very well. BUT, it's lighter than the Marlin and would probably hurt me even more to shoot. Again, bad discs in my neck, so it may different for others. Totally gave up on the 44 in a short, little rifles because of my neck, but for the 35s, the Contender Carbine and the Handi-Rifle have been fantastic pistol-caliber carbines for me.
EDIT: and, by the way, I agree 100% with Needmostuff that you should let the extra barrel provide the extra performance. I personally wouldn't load pistol-caliber cartridges hotter than the pistol was intended to use, especially if I HAD one. What you shoot in your handgun will outperform the handgun by a significant margin when fired in a carbine/rifle barrel.
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tj3006
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Post by tj3006 on Jan 7, 2023 19:56:16 GMT -5
I had a Marlin 44 mag. Sure never thought about recoil in it, am hoping to get my hands on one of the Rossi either in 44 mag or 45 LC. With a steel but plate, I would expect recoil might get the be a problem with lots of shooting in one day, I think a quality 44 mag lever gun, in moderately skill full hands , is an extremely useful gun. If you can get it to feed good heavy Bullets, It makes a decent choice to defend your self against any bear, Not a 1st choice, but a decent choice. And while not an AR, a good lever gun with 10 in the tube, would be much better than any hand gun, for defense. And of course a top notch game getter in side 100 yards and more. Do not over look the Rossi, my .357 is just fine !...tj
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Post by zeus on Jan 7, 2023 23:09:15 GMT -5
The only 44 rifle I think is around here is the old ruger carbine. I haven’t ever fired it but I guess I need to remedy that at some point. Anyone use any of the older tube fed ones?
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Post by x101airborne on Jan 8, 2023 0:17:20 GMT -5
The only 44 rifle I think is around here is the old ruger carbine. I haven’t ever fired it but I guess I need to remedy that at some point. Anyone use any of the older tube fed ones? I have one. I think it was called the "Deerfield Carbine" or something like that. I had to cut a thick leather bolt buffer for it before shooting it, per the suggestions of my gunsmith at the time. I dont shoot it much anymore. Still sits at the side of the gun safe where it is nice and warm near the golden rod.
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Post by x101airborne on Jan 8, 2023 0:23:02 GMT -5
After looking online, best I can tell, mine was way before the "Deerfield" designation. Could still be wrong though.
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Post by zeus on Jan 8, 2023 1:25:35 GMT -5
The Deerstalker designation didn’t last long after the lawsuit threat from maybe Marlin?
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Post by AxeHandle on Jan 8, 2023 9:05:08 GMT -5
Picked up a new Marlin before Remington took over. Have never fired it. Might do that next week! That link you guys posted for the Skinner web site has all sorts of lever gun ideas flitting around in my head.
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Post by silcott on Jan 8, 2023 10:11:43 GMT -5
This is the only 44mag rifle that I have. It's an early Ruger carbine. It belonged to my wife's grandfather. I purchased it after he passed away. I mounted an old Weaver 2.5 power scope on it. It shoots extremely well. It'll shoot about anything under 2" at 100yds. Only thing I don't like is you can't shoot cast because of the gas system.
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Post by bradshaw on Jan 8, 2023 10:46:36 GMT -5
After looking online, best I can tell, mine was way before the "Deerfield" designation. Could still be wrong though. ***** Trey.... you have Bill Ruger’s original Deerstalker gas operated .44 Mag carbine. Receiver styled like the 10/22 .22 LR. Enclosed receiver easy to scope mount, but most I’ve encountered hunting had irons. Bill told me the Deerstalker cost more to produce than he anticipated, and he intended it as a blue collar, grab-and-go deer carbine. I think he killed a wart hog and some other critters with it in Africa, and took it hunting in Blue Mountain Foresst (a.k.a. Corbin Park) in New Hampshire. His later .44 Mag carbine is the Model 99/44 Deerfield. I’ve heard it called the “Deerslayer.” Doubtful, that the Old Man would cotton to a naming one of his guns for killing & slaughter. “Deerfield,” nevertheless carries its own bloodstain... as in the Deerfield Massacre of 1704, when Indians and French attacked the Massachusetts settlement of that name. This is history that would not escape Bill Ruger. All that aside, lessons of the Ruger Mini-14 .223 Remington were applied to the Deerfield .44 Mag, notably the simple John Garand-inspired bolt and operating rod. David Bradshaw
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tj3006
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Post by tj3006 on Jan 8, 2023 11:28:47 GMT -5
The Ruger auto, might be a great rifle, But as always, loading for an auto, one need's remember that the ammo is also the fuel for the mechanism, and as such, you have to pick and choose your bullets and powder. With the lever you have to choose a bullet that will feed and a safe powder charge with enough power to clear the barrel. Now a 77/44 should feed anything you can fit in the mag. Now I am thinking, about the buffalo bore ammo. It shoots a 340 grain WFN at crazy velocity from a hand gun. From a rifle that will feed it, it would be a real beast, I bet 1600 FPS would be quite doable ? maybe more, does Buffalo bore make a load for the 444 marlin ? Now I wonder how hard it is to find a 77/44.
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jeffh
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Post by jeffh on Jan 8, 2023 12:45:07 GMT -5
Makes me wonder, regarding the specificity of ammo for gas-operated autos, how much difference PC would make v. plain cast. I wonder if lead in the gas system would be mitigated enough with PC to make cast in a gas-gun OK. Full disclosure, I have never personally shot cast in a gas-gun and do not know from personal experience that it really IS a problem, but that "knowledge" cost me one day.
In probably '84 or '85, Larry's Pistol & Pawn, in Huntsville had a literal STACK of the Ruger 44 Mag autos, in boxes, stashed above the window which faced the parkway. The stack was as wide as the window and probably five or six boxes deep.
My guess is that they were close-outs from the distributor, and they were going for under $300, if I remember correctly, maybe $269? I was sorely tempted, but was much younger and dumber, so I passed. My assumption was that I'd have to shoot standard-weight, jacketed bullets at full power, which wasn't my interest.
Any magazine-fed gun will impose limitations, based on the magazine and the path the bullet takes to get to the chamber. This is one of the main reasons my eventual main pistol-caliber-carbine ended up being a single-shot.
Once I got the Rossi 92 tuned up though, it would feed anything I put in the magazine, at just over the "book" max overall length. Any nose configuration worked. The heaviest bullets were of no use even if I could have seated them out, because the 1:30" twist would not stabilize them *this is a 357).
The Ruger 77/357 was much the same, after some attention was paid to the magazines. I was able to load NOE 360-180 WFNs to the same length my revolvers use, but I did have to trim brass -.020" to crimp in the crimp-groove of the RDO 359-190 RF. I did not loose powder space with that bullet, it just had a long nose, and oddly, the 190 shot fine in the Rossi, by the way. For the Ruger magazines, I had to do some cleaning up/smoothing of the metal feed-lip insert, clean garbage (new mags) out of them and smooth some surfaces, lube with graphite and reassemble.
I still like the idea of the Ruger 96/44, and wish they'd made one in 357 too - which they still made the 96, period. Never shot one, but do like the detachable magazine over the tube, mostly for the sake of clearing the gun before going back into the house after a middle-o'-th'-night varmint raid.
I don't get a super-fast follow-up shot with the Contender Carbine, but the Handi was faster. One thing which made subsequent shots somewhat faster, but definitely more convenient is loading "speed-strips," every-other-hole, to provide clearance for the girth of the breech. Very handy, easier to manipulate with cold fingers, easier to fish out of a pocket and orient to get them in the chamber nose-first. The single shot also affords the maximum flexibility in bullet weight, design, velocity, etc. I can load specifically for the single-shot or use what I load for the revolvers.
On the opposite end of the scale of what matters, and looking to Ed Harris as a reference, the manually manipulated pistol-caliber-carbines provide an interesting and useful feature in being able to load down to very quiet, yet very effective level for late-night pest-control or small game hunting, just as easily as boosting your revolver load-levels to significant effect, yet happily digest what you're carrying on your pistol-belt.
Not trying to "sell" anything here, rather sharing what comes to mind from what I've experienced. This is something I've scrutinized and experimented with thoroughly for about fifteen years now and I'm hoping something from that experience might help someone, sometime.
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Post by habanero on Jan 8, 2023 12:50:13 GMT -5
That speed strip idea is something I’ve never thought of.
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