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Post by bushog on Apr 1, 2021 15:54:49 GMT -5
One negative is the turnaround time is now 10 weeks. I hope he can maybe get some help. I like Accurate Mold molds. I ordered one and got it in 3 weeks and that was a week ago...I didn't ask how long, just ordered the mold. Maybe I got lucky or maybe he just doesn't want to disappoint people... |
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Post by Lee Martin on Apr 1, 2021 15:57:01 GMT -5
Keith liked the square edge and felt it was better at holding lube. But lubes have come a long way in 80 years. Elmer did claim the square edge improved accuracy. I've yet to see evidence of such. Like most of you, I've shot cast bullets with square edges and angled transitions. If an angled groove throws dynamic stability out of whack, I want nothing to do with that bullet. But I'm open to being shown otherwise ("otherwise" meaning targets). As an aside, when Bradshaw designed our 194 gr SWC, the groove lead was hardly discussed (if at all). The groove angle was set to 45 degrees. That bullet flies as good, if not better, than any cast bullet I've shot from a handgun. Do I think a square edge would change that? Nope. -Lee www.singleactions.com"Chasing perfection five shots at a time" |
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Post by boolitdesigner on Apr 1, 2021 16:01:54 GMT -5
Has anyone ever made a Keith bullet with a square lube groove and an identical bullet with a round corner lube groove and tested it in a known accurate handgun (and several rifles) and see if there is a real or imagined accuracy difference?Not just shooting a couple 5 shot groups but several to confirm the findings. Yes, over a year (Why, because I wanted to know why it was and how it worked and I found out with a totally unexpected bonus of spectacular accuracy when transferred to other things) in various degrees of hot and cold with attendant weather conditions with close to extended ranges. Keith's statement was correct about the lube groove. |
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Post by webber on Apr 1, 2021 16:13:22 GMT -5
You proved the superior accuracy with the square lube grooves with absolute identical bullets other than a rounded lube groove and a square lube groove and NO OTHER CHANGES AT ALL? Has anyone ever made a Keith bullet with a square lube groove and an identical bullet with a round corner lube groove and tested it in a known accurate handgun (and several rifles) and see if there is a real or imagined accuracy difference?Not just shooting a couple 5 shot groups but several to confirm the findings. Yes, over a year (Why, because I wanted to know why it was and how it worked and I found out with a totally unexpected bonus of spectacular accuracy when transferred to other things) in various degrees of hot and cold with attendant weather conditions with close to extended ranges. Keith's statement was correct about the lube groove. |
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Post by bradshaw on Apr 1, 2021 16:13:24 GMT -5
“..... you just have to see for yourself as no amount of explanation will get through to people on controversial items.”
----boolitdesigner
*****
A discipline hasn’t come along to displace the firing line of IHMSA competition. Great hand gunning has been done for generations approaching two centuries. Handgun silhouette exploded skill to a vastly broader base. The steel game killed various myths, relentlessly driving CONSISTENCY. To impress this crowd requires a trip to the Firing Line. Bullets on target talk.
David Bradshaw
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Post by boolitdesigner on Apr 1, 2021 16:40:48 GMT -5
You proved the superior accuracy with the square lube grooves with absolute identical bullets other than a rounded lube groove and a square lube groove and NO OTHER CHANGES AT ALL?Yes, over a year (Why, because I wanted to know why it was and how it worked and I found out with a totally unexpected bonus of spectacular accuracy when transferred to other things) in various degrees of hot and cold with attendant weather conditions with close to extended ranges. Keith's statement was correct about the lube groove. Yes.... using Keith's bullet (Keith's bullet at his time period....) and alloy choice/loading. Really old news as I'm just repeating what Keith said. |
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Post by silcott on Apr 1, 2021 16:56:53 GMT -5
I just ordered a 4 cavity. I have six different 41's to try this bullet in. Including a Marlin. I should be able to determine how it performs.
Justin
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Post by 41freak on Apr 1, 2021 18:14:55 GMT -5
I just ordered a 4 cavity. I have six different 41's to try this bullet in. Including a Marlin. I should be able to determine how it performs. Justin I ordered one of the 41-240V molds and have some cast up need to get coated and sized and plan to test them @ 100 yes as well. Hopefully work will slow down so I can get to the range soon. |
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Post by webber on Apr 1, 2021 19:56:33 GMT -5
Now, if the accuracy of the square lube groove is superior, is it superior with a shallow but adequate lube groove or with a deep square lube groove? Is there, with today's superior lube, a need for a deep lube groove or is the shallow one as as accurate? Have you tried a square shallow lube groove compared to a rounded shallow lube groove for extreme accuracy? Same question concerning wide square lube groove compared to narrow square lube groove accuracy-wise to a rounded wide lube groove compared to a rounded narrow lube groove Provided they are adequate to prevent leading? You proved the superior accuracy with the square lube grooves with absolute identical bullets other than a rounded lube groove and a square lube groove and NO OTHER CHANGES AT ALL? Yes.... using Keith's bullet (Keith's bullet at his time period....) and alloy choice/loading. Really old news as I'm just repeating what Keith said. |
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Post by bradshaw on Apr 1, 2021 20:45:53 GMT -5
Keith liked the square edge and felt it was better at holding lube. But lubes have come a long way in 80 years. Elmer did claim the square edge improved accuracy. I've yet to see evidence of such. Like most of you, I've shot cast bullets with square edges and angled transitions. If an angled groove throws dynamic stability out of whack, I want nothing to do with that bullet. But I'm open to being shown otherwise ("otherwise" meaning targets). As an aside, when Bradshaw designed our 194 gr SWC, the groove lead was hardly discussed (if at all). The groove angle was set to 45 degrees. That bullet flies as good, if not better, than any cast bullet I've shot from a handgun. Do I think a square edge would change that? Nope. -Lee www.singleactions.com"Chasing perfection five shots at a time" ***** Yeah, we could wear ourselves out playing the minutiae game. Instead, we try to apply lessons learned throwing lead. Often enough, the Firing Line reveals----to borrow a Lee Martin phrase----there’s more than one way to skin a cat. I had the adventure of shooting superbly accurate revolvers from Smith & Wesson and Ruger before I ever heard about “line-boring.” You can bet those super-accurate sixguns were NOT line-bored. When I joined Singleactions, great incantations were made to recutting the crown on a revolver muzzle, ostensibly to purify the bullet’s flight. I saw my work cut out. While I came to silhouette with some shooting under my belt, the competitive firing line drove me to pfind what builds and what does not build revolver accuracy. If I was going to talk about this stuff, I had to articulate dimensional relationships. Literate criticism requires articulation. While the Bradshaw-Martin .357 194-grain SWC GC intends a degree of versatility, it set out to serve the Ruger Blackhawk .357 Maximum, a revolver, good or bad, I had a hand in. So far, it appears our bullet shoots. One day we may shoot it with grease in the grooves. It is meant for POWDER COAT, with grease grooves an alternative. I think of the bands as driving bands----think artillery shell----as opposed to shoulders for grease grooves. Lands push on a bullet, imposing a degree of displacement. It’s better to pinch a bullet than rattle it. Theory might look at the Bradshaw-Martin 194 as having too-short a wheelbase for long range stability. Had theory won out, we’d make another bullet. The long nose should compliment ballistic coefficient, but more importantly push COG (Center of Gravity) rearward. So far, seems this bullet enjoys flying straight. One thing I love about the competitive firing line, a SHARPSHOOTER respects what works. The Firing Line is a no-bullroar zone. David Bradshaw |
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Post by 41freak on Apr 25, 2021 11:43:52 GMT -5
The Lee Martin 315gr 45 design is in Accurate Molds catalog as 45-319D  |
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Post by white eagle on May 13, 2021 9:15:06 GMT -5
I have been working with Tom for Years
he is an excellent mold maker
some items on a design can be changed they way you like just ask him
he has altered many of my designs when asked
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Post by bigbore5 on May 15, 2021 6:51:44 GMT -5
Tom is making a modified version of the 51-350k for me. Changed the meplat size and ogive from tangential to secant profile. The only hard part is his current backlog. I ordered it on April 7th. Still waiting
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Post by silcott on May 15, 2021 10:58:12 GMT -5
Tom is making a modified version of the 51-350k for me. Changed the meplat size and ogive from tangential to secant profile. The only hard part is his current backlog. I ordered it on April 7th. Still waiting I ordered one of Lee's molds from him on April 1. Still waiting on it. Justin |
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Post by 41freak on May 17, 2021 6:18:57 GMT -5
With the COVID and election anything gun related has been hammered with orders, the last mold I ordered from Tom took about 9 weeks. I sure miss the old days of ordering one of his molds and getting it within several days. Which reminds me I have to order another mold.
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