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Post by Encore64 on Aug 6, 2024 19:28:32 GMT -5
For some time, I've repeated read about the "loose" 45 Colt Chambers that Freedom Arms uses in their revolvers.
This crossed my mind a few days back while checking out the early 454 Casull.
These chambers are all tapered a bit. A .479" Pin Gauge is the largest that'll start in my three guns (454 Casull) chambers.
So, I decided to check the chambers in my FA97 45 Colts. All chambers in both guns would start a .481" Pin Gauge. But, just as the 454 Casull Chambers, they're tapered and the gauge stops about 3/4" in the chambers.
This confirms they are larger than 454 Casull Chambers.
Then, I measured brass. Starline 454 Casull measured .475" across the web. Their 45 Colt was .476". I found a few .0005" larger and the same larger.
Top Brass (Brand) 45 Colt measured .477".
Clearly, I haven't measured all FA 45 Colt Chambers. Ditto on different brands of 45 Colt Brass.
But, expansion area around the case is very little different in my guns.
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Post by bigbrowndog on Aug 6, 2024 19:32:44 GMT -5
What is SAAMI spec for said chambers??? Remember chamber specs are not the same as cartridge specs.
Trapr
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shorty500
.327 Meteor
too many dirty harry movies created me!
Posts: 934
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Post by shorty500 on Aug 6, 2024 19:37:22 GMT -5
For some time, I've repeated read about the "loose" 45 Colt Chambers that Freedom Arms uses in their revolvers. This crossed my mind a few days back while checking out the early 454 Casull. These chambers are all tapered a bit. A .479" Pin Gauge is the largest that'll start in my three guns (454 Casull) chambers. So, I decided to check the chambers in my FA97 45 Colts. All chambers in both guns would start a .481" Pin Gauge. But, just as the 454 Casull Chambers, they're tapered and the gauge stops about 3/4" in the chambers. This confirms they are larger than 454 Casull Chambers. Then, I measured brass. Starline 454 Casull measured .475" across the web. Their 45 Colt was .476". I found a few .0005" larger and the same larger. Top Brass (Brand) 45 Colt measured .477". Clearly, I haven't measured all FA 45 Colt Chambers. Ditto on different brands of 45 Colt Brass. But, expansion area around the case is very little different in my opinion guns. I’ve seen slightly worse- both Colt chambered cylinders in my possession barely admit a -.483 pin suggesting they are cut to the SAAMI MINIMUM tolerance for 5he old Colt cartridge. While I’d prefer a tighter Casull diameter I’ve had quite good case life out of kinda stupid loads in the old Federal cases of 80-90’s vintage and basically the same from Starline. |
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Post by Encore64 on Aug 6, 2024 19:41:03 GMT -5
For some time, I've repeated read about the "loose" 45 Colt Chambers that Freedom Arms uses in their revolvers. This crossed my mind a few days back while checking out the early 454 Casull. These chambers are all tapered a bit. A .479" Pin Gauge is the largest that'll start in my three guns (454 Casull) chambers. So, I decided to check the chambers in my FA97 45 Colts. All chambers in both guns would start a .481" Pin Gauge. But, just as the 454 Casull Chambers, they're tapered and the gauge stops about 3/4" in the chambers. This confirms they are larger than 454 Casull Chambers. Then, I measured brass. Starline 454 Casull measured .475" across the web. Their 45 Colt was .476". I found a few .0005" larger and the same larger. Top Brass (Brand) 45 Colt measured .477". Clearly, I haven't measured all FA 45 Colt Chambers. Ditto on different brands of 45 Colt Brass. But, expansion area around the case is very little different in my opinion guns. I’ve seen slightly worse- both Colt chambered cylinders in my possession barely admit a -.483 pin suggesting they are cut to the SAAMI MINIMUM tolerance for 5he old Colt cartridge. While I’d prefer a tighter Casull diameter I’ve had quite good case life out of kinda stupid loads in the old Federal cases of 80-90’s vintage and basically the same from Starline. Excellent Information, Thanks... Hopefully others will measure chambers and post. |
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Post by bigbrowndog on Aug 6, 2024 19:43:44 GMT -5
I checked SAAMI,……
454 case. Is .4775 at rear of case and claims cylindrical
454 chamber is .4797 at rear and .4779 at front
45Colt case is .480 at rear and claims cylindrical
45Colt chamber is .4862 at rear and ..4806 at front
Trapr
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Post by Encore64 on Aug 6, 2024 19:48:55 GMT -5
Well, that puts my 454 Casull Chambers spot on and the 45 Colt Chambers .005" smaller than Specs.
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Post by 45MAN on Aug 6, 2024 20:05:33 GMT -5
WHEN I SPEAK OF LOOSE 45 COLT CHAMBERS IN FA REVOLVERS I AM REFERRING TO THE 45 COLT CYLINDERS FOR MODEL 83 454 REVOLVERS NOT MODEL 97 45 COLT CHAMBERS.
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Post by Encore64 on Aug 6, 2024 20:09:31 GMT -5
WHEN I SPEAK OF LOOSE 45 COLT CHAMBERS IN FA REVOLVERS I AM REFERRING TO THE 45 COLT CYLINDERS FOR MODEL 83 454 REVOLVERS NOT MODEL 97 45 COLT CHAMBERS. I was curious about that. This is something I've heard for years. Does FA use different specs for 45 Colt Chambers in the 83 and 97? That would really be strange to me. |
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Post by 45MAN on Aug 6, 2024 20:18:08 GMT -5
GOING TO Punta FOR A COUPLE OF DAYS, LATER THIS WEEK I WILL TRY TO GET SOME MEASUREMENTS WITH CALIPERS.
ALSO, IN MY MODEL 97 I RUN RUGER LOADS, IN MY MODEL 83's I RAN 454 EQUIVALENT LOADS.
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Post by Encore64 on Aug 6, 2024 20:23:04 GMT -5
GOING TO Punta FOR A COUPLE OF DAYS, LATER THIS WEEK I WILL TRY TO GET SOME MEASUREMENTS WITH CALIPERS. ALSO, IN MY MODEL 97 I RUN RUGER LOADS, IN MY MODEL 83's I RAN 454 EQUIVALENT LOADS. Thanks... It'll be interesting to find out the variations. |
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gcf
.30 Stingray
South Texas
Posts: 316
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Post by gcf on Aug 9, 2024 14:54:24 GMT -5
So, I decided to check the chambers in my FA97 45 Colts. All chambers in both guns would start a .481" Pin Gauge. But, just as the 454 Casull Chambers, they're tapered and the gauge stops about 3/4" in the chambers. Clearly not a FA97, but out of curiosity, pinned the .45 Colt cylinder on my flattop Bisley conversion: a uniform 0.481" on the rear of all six. Actually more than a bit surprised...   |
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Post by bradshaw on Aug 9, 2024 15:50:54 GMT -5
Federal and Starline .45 Colt brass of some of my loads fired in the Ruger 03 chamber in the .45 Colt cylinder of my 4-3/4” Freedom Arms M83. Brass of full house loads fired in the Ruger 03 don’t fully seat in the M83 chambers. Haven’t tried pin gauges in either revolver.
David Bradshaw
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Post by 45MAN on Aug 9, 2024 15:58:53 GMT -5
LINEBAUGH AND JACK HUNTINGTON CHAMBER CUSTOM CYLINDERS REAL TIGHT, MAYBE TIGHTER THAN MINIMUM 45 COLT SPECS. NOT SURE WHAT BOWEN DOES.
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Post by Encore64 on Aug 9, 2024 18:48:52 GMT -5
So, get this one. I've got a new Blackhawk 45 Colt that I bought recently.
After reading the above posts, I decided to measure it.
A .481" Pin Gauge won't even try to start in the chambers. A .480" tries to start for about 1/4", but won't go farther.
It took a .479" to go in the Ruger Chambers!!! That's less than .001" larger than my FA 454 Chambers.
Considering the 45 Colt Brass is slightly larger than 454 Brass, that means the Ruger Chambers are tighter relatively than the FA 454.
Never saw that one coming...
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Post by 45MAN on Aug 9, 2024 20:01:57 GMT -5
I USE A REDDING 454/45 COLT RESIZING DIE FOR MY 45 COLT RELOADING. IIRC, MY LEE FACTORY CRIMP DIES ARE MARKED FOR 45 COLT AND 454. GUYS SHOOT 45 COLT BRASS IN 454 FA CYLINDERS. AS A PRACTICAL MATTER, OTHER THAN PRIMER SIZE AND LENGTH, OUTWARDLY THE 45 COLT AND 454 CASES ARE IDENTICAL AND THE TYPICAL RUGER CYLINDER CAN BE IMPROVED ON via A CUSTOM CHAMBERED TIGHT CHAMBERED CYLINDER.
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