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Post by ss30378 on Apr 6, 2024 22:08:51 GMT -5
I acquired a 44 bfr Bisley a few weeks ago since I was missing a 44 in my safe for far too long. I've owned (and sold off) a few Redhawks in the past couple of years but my last 44 single action was a Ruger Super Blackhawk bisley hunter which I regretfully sold about 10 years ago when money was tight. Before I sold it, I was envisioning having it converted to an oversized cylinder to shoot redhawk-type +p loads. The bfr Bisley is essentially that gun in factory form. I have a 454 and 500 Linebaugh bfr and enjoy them so the 44 was an easy choice. I got mine from Bud's since no one else had a Bisley model in stock and it was at my FFL a few days later. This is a 6-shot 7.5" model.
Initial thoughts: It's shiny and well fitted, better than a Ruger, not quite FA bank vault fit but nice. I measured a.0025" barrel cylinder gap with a slight bit of rotational play with the hammer pulled back. The throats were tight, but uniform at .4295". After a few minutes with a Manson cylinder throat reamer, they are now all a uniform .431" since I mostly shoot cast bullets that average .430-.431. I love the "bisley" grip on the bfr but the bottom edge of the micarta is too sharp for my liking and how I hold out of the box so I rounded the bottom edge to take out the bite. Other than the throats and sharp edges I was happy with my purchase.
Factory Loads: I had a few factory loads I've picked up over time so I wanted to see what they ran out of the BFR. 180g Remington UMC: Rated at 1610fps, actual from BFR = 1740fps 240g Federal JHP: Rated at 1230fps, actual from BFR = 1500fps 240g Magtech JSP: Rated at 1178fps, actual from BFR = 1350fps 340g +P+ BBA (These are 12-13 years old): Rated at 1425fps, actual from BFR = 1520fps (this is a cannon of a load, 1744lbs of energy)
H110 Load ladder with MBC 300g "Hammer" (powder coated version), cci350s and starline brass 24.0g @ 1.725" OAL = 1427fps/1356lbs energy 25.0g @ 1.725" OAL = 1450fps/1400lbs energy 26.0g @ 1.725" OAL = 1527fps/1553lbs energy 27.0g (Compressed) @ 1.728" OAL = 1590fps/ 1684lbs energy 28.0g @ 1.825" OAL (crimped in upper lube groove) = 1577fps/1656lbs 29.0g @ 1.825" OAL (crimped in upper lube groove) = 1634fps/1778lbs
Primers were flat with higher loads but no sticky extraction occurred in any of the loads. This is pushing lower-end 454 levels, I was running a 325g at 1700fps in my 6.5" BFR 454 last week with 300mp powder and will do a ladder with that next.
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Post by hunter01 on Apr 6, 2024 22:20:38 GMT -5
There are no flies at all on the 44mag. It can and has done everything any other revolver cartridge has done. You are definitely nipping on the heels of normal 454 loads. If it was just released, everyone would be singing its praises. Its too bad its so "yesterday". Maybe if we started calling it the 44 creedmoor it would come back around.
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Post by potatojudge on Apr 6, 2024 23:01:54 GMT -5
OAL is within a 1/10th of an inch of 445 SuperMag and your top end data is pretty much 445. That MBC bullet has plenty of options for crimping to vary OAL, which is the only way to get that much H110 in a 44 mag case.
Seeing a drop in velocity from 27 to 28 then back up at 29 grains tell you to stay under 27 grains or, and this is the better answer, change powders for that long powder column.
These loads don't have much in common with SAAMI 44 magnum except for using the same brass gasket. That's code for "don't try this at home" in a lesser gun. I do believe you're making the most of the BFR and the 44 Mag, and maybe then some.
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Post by ss30378 on Apr 6, 2024 23:55:47 GMT -5
OAL is within a 1/10th of an inch of 445 SuperMag and your top end data is pretty much 445. That MBC bullet has plenty of options for crimping to vary OAL, which is the only way to get that much H110 in a 44 mag case. Seeing a drop in velocity from 27 to 28 then back up at 29 grains tell you to stay under 27 grains or, and this is the better answer, change powders for that long powder column. These loads don't have much in common with SAAMI 44 magnum except for using the same brass gasket. That's code for "don't try this at home" in a lesser gun. I do believe you're making the most of the BFR and the 44 Mag, and maybe then some. The Bold above is definitely applicable!! DO NOT DUPLICATE THESE LOADS!!! I agree, I'm in the middle ground between 44 and 445 with the 1.825" loads. I have 300mp, aa5744 and aa1680 on hand to test as well to see how they like the longer length but h110 didn't seem to be getting unstable. All six rounds were very consistent with all loads. I think the main reason for the velocity drop was me extending out the OAL by almost .100" dropping the pressure quite a bit hence the drop in velocity. Then it caught back up once I added enough powder to compensate. I worked up a similar ladder with my redhawk and this same bullet and can of h110 with similar results as the bfr. I ran 28g of h110 @ 1.735" (max compressed) in the redhawk and it was still linear (and over 1620fps). The BFR 44 has the extra cylinder length over the Redhawk which gives handloaders some options. Being a 44/445 hybrid at the long OAL I can get the same velocity with less pressure or get more velocity at similar pressures. Or run even heavier bullets out past 1.8" and see what it can do. I'll post new data as I get time to get it.
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Post by bigbore5 on Apr 7, 2024 5:18:34 GMT -5
Makes one wonder what a properly dimensioned bullet from a custom mold could do at the BFR max oal. Or with 1.390" brass. Add another BFR to the gotta get list now.
You guys keep causing me to think and that costs me money. I just ordered a 357 version for the 41 Casull idea that was brn on here a month ago.
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Post by Encore64 on Apr 7, 2024 5:22:42 GMT -5
This is excellent reporting and data. Very similar to what I found with the BFR 357 Magnum.
The 44 Magnum is certainly no has been when loaded to suit the BFR.
Thanks much for your efforts and sharing these results...
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Post by blackmamba on Apr 7, 2024 12:36:06 GMT -5
Montana Bullets makes a WLN 315 gr. gas checked bullet with a .425" nose to crimp to maximize powder capacity. I think that would be a real killer in a BFR or model 83.
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cmillard
.375 Atomic
MOLON LABE
Posts: 1,943
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Post by cmillard on Apr 7, 2024 15:18:49 GMT -5
I would be curious to see how a 405 grain .44 cast bullet would do
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Post by CraigC on Apr 7, 2024 15:29:28 GMT -5
That was pretty much the goal when I had Jack build this one, along with sharing data with the Super Redhawk. When I was able to get a Beartooth 355gr to 1350fps, with a case full of H110 and crimped in the lower crimp groove, I knew I had accomplished what I wanted. It matches the sectional density and velocity of the legendary 430gr .475 load and is a better penetrator than the 360gr .45 WLN. I think the ~400gr are overboard, where not only do you not get them to any meaningful velocity, they don't increase penetration either. I got the Beartooth 405gr to 1160fps. Problem is that Beartooth is now defunct and the few hundred 355's I have left are all there is.
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Post by bigbore5 on Apr 7, 2024 16:14:52 GMT -5
That was pretty much the goal when I had Jack build this one, along with sharing data with the Super Redhawk. When I was able to get a Beartooth 355gr to 1350fps, with a case full of H110 and crimped in the lower crimp groove, I knew I had accomplished what I wanted. It matches the sectional density and velocity of the legendary 430gr .475 load and is a better penetrator than the 360gr .45 WLN. I think the ~400gr are overboard, where not only do you not get them to any meaningful velocity, they don't increase penetration either. I got the Beartooth 405gr to 1160fps. Problem is that Beartooth is now defunct and the few hundred 355's I have left are all there is. They may be out of business, but Accurate isn't. All you need to do is send him the dimensions.
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brant
.30 Stingray
Posts: 341
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Post by brant on Apr 7, 2024 16:44:23 GMT -5
Craig, that is. A lovely handgun!
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Post by longoval on Apr 7, 2024 21:42:54 GMT -5
Craig, that is. A lovely handgun! Yes, his photography skills are only exceeded by his taste in guns.
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Post by longoval on Apr 7, 2024 21:45:59 GMT -5
SS, Between 24 and 29 gr H110 (albeit at different OAL), where was the sweet spot regarding extreme spread and standard deviation?
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Post by ss30378 on Apr 7, 2024 23:11:13 GMT -5
SS, Between 24 and 29 gr H110 (albeit at different OAL), where was the sweet spot regarding extreme spread and standard deviation? The 26g load was the best of the bunch at 24fps ES The 29g long load was a close 2nd at 31fps ES The rest weren't terrible but were in the 50-70fps ES range
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Post by CraigC on Apr 7, 2024 23:15:15 GMT -5
They may be out of business, but Accurate isn't. All you need to do is send him the dimensions. Then I'll have to find somebody to cast `em!
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