FA 83 454 CASULL LBT 325gr WFN

[silcott]

I bought a 45cal LBT 325gr WFN PB from Sixshot. I cast, powder coated and sized around 50pcs from this mold. Loaded a dummy round to verify that it fits my revolver. Fits perfectly with about .030 (didn't actually measure) to the end of the cylinder.

Trying to decide where to start with my loads. I can find loads with a 325gr LFN,& WLN, but this is a WFN.

Thinking that 26.0gr of H110 would be a good starting point.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.

Right now the biggest thing shot with this bullet would be an Ohio deer.

Thanks
Justin

[contender]

Good bullets.
Poor deer.

No help on the load,, as I don't use H110 or that bullet in my .454.

[Fowler]

Nose shape doesn't really affect your loads vs the books in any meaningful way, and 325gr cast bullet load will work fine for you.

I would advise to start at a medium power level with something other than H110 and work up, the 45 colt can get spicy with Ruger only loads and that bullet. Fully 454 loads should be worked up to, I think if my flawed memory is right your proposed "starting" load should approach 1500fps...

[silcott]

Sept 21, 2023 9:25:40 GMT -5 Fowler said:

Nose shape doesn't really affect your loads vs the books in any meaningful way, and 325gr cast bullet load will work fine for you.

I would advise to start at a medium power level with something other than H110 and work up, the 45 colt can get spicy with Ruger only loads and that bullet. Fully 454 loads should be worked up to, I think if my flawed memory is right your proposed "starting" load should approach 1500fps...

Wasn't sure if the WFN had more bullet in the case than a WLN.

What powder do you recommend over H110?


Justin

[edk]

The differing nose profiles do impact how much bullet is in the case BUT nose-to-crimp plays a part in that as well. You just don't know how much shank is in the case with the Cast Performance LFN vs your LBT WFN. Cast performance uses the terms WFN/LFN & WLN similarly as does Veral Smith however Veral stressed they were not a LBT customer. Not to mention hypothetically Veral would cut one guy a stubby nose 325gr WFN for a short cylinder FA model 97 and the next guy a long nose 325gr WFN for his Ruger Redhawk resulting in significant differences in available case volume. No easy answer on this one.

Note that all three Hodgdon loads use 26gr of H110 and each achieve 1500fps but look at the differences in pressure! It would be a good idea to work with a chronograph. H110/WW296 are acknowledged as THE powder for top loads and there's no reason not to use it. However I happen to also like AA9 and Ramshot enforcer in the 454 with the understanding that a 1350fps 300-320gr LBT bullet will work for my purposes and I shouldn't be downloading H110 that much.

[Fowler]

Sept 21, 2023 11:51:13 GMT -5 silcott said:

Sept 21, 2023 9:25:40 GMT -5 Fowler said:

Nose shape doesn't really affect your loads vs the books in any meaningful way, and 325gr cast bullet load will work fine for you.

I would advise to start at a medium power level with something other than H110 and work up, the 45 colt can get spicy with Ruger only loads and that bullet. Fully 454 loads should be worked up to, I think if my flawed memory is right your proposed "starting" load should approach 1500fps...

Wasn't sure if the WFN had more bullet in the case than a WLN.

What powder do you recommend over H110?


Justin

Published loads all have a margin for error built in due to our litigious society we all live in these days.

That said for mid range stuff, HS6, Power Pistol, Unique, AA9, 2400 all have their place. Brian Pearce wrote one of his exhaustive articles in Handloader magazine issue 330 feb-mar 2021...

[bigbrowndog]

The pressure difference is due to jacketed bullets and a heavier bullet, so technically not an even comparison. It does show why a jacketed bullet load used for a cast bullet is typically safer, as opposed to a cast bullet load used on a jacketed bullet, without pressure data available. If your not concerned with pushing the bullet beyond Ruger only load specs, I’d say load it to those levels and leave the bullet loaded long at 454 OAL and chrono to verify speed, or deep seat the bullet to 45 colt OAL and use the Ruger only load data, then verify speed on chrono.

Trapr

[silcott]

I have Brian's article on the 454.

1500 fps is around where I'm wanting to try this bullet. I have loads with H110, H4227, & #9 that will get me in the ballpark. Looks like I'll just have to assemble some and see what the fps comes out to.

Thanks
Justin

[bigbore5]

Sept 21, 2023 15:25:34 GMT -5 silcott said:

I have Brian's article on the 454.

1500 fps is around where I'm wanting to try this bullet. I have loads with H110, H4227, & #9 that will get me in the ballpark. Looks like I'll just have to assemble some and see what the fps comes out to.

Thanks
Justin

Measure the base to crimp length. I find it easiest to measure a case,then seat a bullet to the crimp groove as a dummy round without crimping it. Measure the oil. Add the case length to the bullet length then subtract the oal of the dummy round. That's how much the bullet protrudes into the case. Find a similar weight bullet that protrudes into the case the same amount that does have data and you will be okay using that data for reference.

If you can't find a similar bullet with data, then weigh a primed case. A fired case works as long as the primer hole isn't empty. Then fill the case with distilled water to the brim. Subtract the weight of the empty case from the full one's.

With your cases true capacity in water and the information on your bullets base to crimp, GRT or quickloads programs can determine a good load range to try.

[daveb]

I have that same old, mine weigh 332gr from my alloy, I powder coat, size to .452, and 99% of the time shoot HS6 for 1250-1300 FPS, great bullet, easy to cast. I will look at my notes and see if I have used H110 with it.

Dave

[sixshot]

When I had a 10" 454 years ago it would not accept a .452" sized bullet, had to be .451" to chamber. Not sure but I think both of my friend Larry's guns will accept .452" bullets, everything can make a difference & when dealing with high pressure, go slowly. H110 usually has a pretty narrow window to work with as far as pressures so Larry took into consideration the higher temps of Africa when working up his loads. My 325 gr bullets came out of an Applegate mould so I'm guessing there might be a slight difference in nose to crimp length. Good luck with your loads!
Dick

[silcott]

Both of my 454's will chamber a .452 cast bullet.

I have done a lot of comparison checks with this bullet to several other cast and jacketed from 300-335gr.

I've come up with a good starting point for several powders. I've burned a lot of H110 and #9 in a couple different 454's. I wanna start with those two and eventually move to a couple different powders to explore my options.

Not in a hurry. I'll most likely not carry a 454 hunting this year. Haven't took a deer with my 41mag. planing to use it this year.

Thanks all
Justin

[matt56]

I shoot a WFNGC 350gr 45-70 bullet deep seated and sized for my SBH at .454. 23.0gr H110 is good, 24.0 is getting a little hot. Sounds like you’re in the right range

[sixshot]

Don't want to get too far off topic here but that is impressive! I had to read it twice what matt56 wrote to grasp it. Here is a gun you can buy for under $1,000 & push a 350 gr 45 bullet, sized to .454", deep seat it & push it out the barrel with either 23.0 grs or 24.0 grs of H110! Talk about some major horsepower, yikes! That load would knock down a bull Rhino!!

Dick

[45MAN]

I USED TO LOAD A GC'ed 325gr WFN TO OVER 1,600fps IN W-W 45 COLT CASES IN A 10" 45 COLT CYLINDERED FA MODEL 83 454. ABANDONED THE LOAD BECAUSE OUT OF EVERY 3 SHOT GROUP AT 100 METERS I WOULD GET 2 CLOSE TOGETHER AND 1 FLYER. DO NOT KNOW WHY. TOO BAD BECAUSE I DEAD CENTERED A BIG ELAND BULL IN THE SHOULDER (BROADSIDE), HE RAN 50 -60 YARDS AND DROPPED DEAD. I OFFERED THE SKINNER, TRACKER A $5.00 REWARD FOR THE BULLET, BUT DID NOT HAVE TO PAY IT. WHEN THEY TURNED THE BULL OVER WE COULD SEE IT WAS A COMPLETE PASS THRU THE OFF SHOULDER, IMPRESSIVE. A BUDDY, ON THE SAME SAFARI, DID THE SAME SHOULDER SHOT TO A BIG ELAND BULL WITH HIS 375 H&H USING A FEDERAL 300gr BEARCLAW LOAD. THE BULLET WENT MIDWAY THRU THE BULL AND STOPPED.