Ruger #1 30-30 Ackley Improved Opinions?

[williamiorg]

Looks like you have a good baseline already.

One of the best articles I've seen on a strong, close breeched .30-30 is Phil Sharpe's article from the March 1952 issue of the American Rifleman. "That Old Thutty Thutty"
Phil's friend Dick Hart brought a 19 lb. 12 oz. Winchester Hi Wall with a 31" barrel.
Phil was trying for a 1/2" five shot group from a .30 caliber rifle. Phil got very close.

Phil gave a load chart and was pushing the 110 grain bullets to 3,000 fps.
The 150 grain bullets to just short of 2,600 fps.
The 180 grain bullets he was using were pushed up over 2,550 fps with many loads above 2,350 fps.
While I could never match his accuracy with my leverguns. I got up close with velocities quite easily.
I shot quite a few different spitzers through the Marlin and Winchester leveractions and was pleased with the good accuracy from the 1 in 12" twist barrels.

[Encore64]

I'll admit a 24" Barrel might be the best choice. But, I'll be down to two rifles with 22" Barrels.

Fortunately, both guns will be brute strong single shots. Chamber throats will be my only limiting factor when seating bullets.

Phil Sharpe, P.O. Ackley and Ken Waters are my Gun Heros. Devoted handloaders that put the sport first.

Brian Pearce is moving up in the pecking order quickly. He writes in a rare fashion that focuses on the shooter's needs instead of the manufacturer's wants...

[450ak]

Having a 30/30 Ackley in a Winchester model 64A for a while, I can say a few things about the cartridge.
It will shoot faster than the standard chambering. Case life is pretty good (Winchester brass) . If I manage to land a bullet in the right place it works. I’m not entirely certain the improved chamber is worth the trouble. This rifle was already rechambered and came with dies. I was curious as I had read Mr Iorg’s posts about the cartridge. I have killed a bunch of deer and antelope with the standard chamber, mostly with the 130 Speer. Of course when I wander in the beartooths I’m loaded with 170 partitions. That bullet is a bulldozer! From cow elk on down it works well.
Thank you Mr. Iorg for you research and counsel.

[nhithaca]

While I like the suggestion of re-chambering to the 308 Marlin, I think you will find that the case length is shorter than the 30-30 and without setting the barrel back it won't work. Just my two-cents.
You could re-chamber to the 307 Winchester which is just the 308 with a rim and is roughly the same case length as the 30-30 (and is the parent case for the 308 Marlin). Others have claimed that standard 308 cases will extract and feed in a 307 gun. But you would not want to load them to 308 pressures!!!

[Encore64]

I spent a good bit of the morning developing loads for the 30-30 Ackley Improved. My present rifle is a JRH Rechambered Henry Single Shot with a 22" Barrel.

Cases are FC Fireformed
Primers are LR
Powder is Leverevolution

Bullets were varied, but I'm only reporting Hornady 150 grn SST data...

38.5 grn. 2540 fps
39.0 grn. 2612 fps
39.5 grn. 2640 fps*

*Was starting to show operating pressures on the primers. Only slight flattening and no sticking.

Note that 38.5 grn of Leverevolution is heavily compressed in the 30-30 WCF Case. I had to get to 40.5 grn before compressing powder in the Improved Case. No loads over 39.5 grn were fired. The 40.5 grn was just to measure case capacity.

It's extremely hot here, so I'm stopping there. My preferred load is 39.0 grn Leverevolution Powder behind the Hornady 150 grn SST.

Duplicates 300 Savage with a much higher BC Bullet. I can't ask for more from the old 30-30 Case...

[Encore64]

Switched to CCI 34 Primers...

Added about 20 fps to above loads. No primer flattening with these. Cases fall out of gun and rechamber with no resistance.

Switched to Hornady 165 grn Interlock Bullets...

37.0 grn 2455 fps
37.5 grn 2498 fps

No excessive pressure signs, but seemed a logical outcome. I'll stop here...

Note: I fireformed 5 cases using 9.5 grn Unique behind a 165 grn Cast Bullets to start today's testing. The same 5 cases have been used for all the above testing. All are still going strong.

I backed the FL Sizer Die off the Shellholder .030" and haven't touched the shoulder once. All have dropped in the chamber with no resistance. A sure sign of zero spring in the gun's action...

[Encore64]

Cast Bullets...

I realize I've hijacked my own thread. I've gone from talking about a rifle to a cartridge. But, $&!+ happens...

Shooting the cast bullets over Unique is lots of fun. I bought a lifetime supply of CheyCast 165 grn Bullets when they had the bulk boxes on sale.

I was testing out cast bullets before rechambering to Ackley Improved.

11.0 grn of Unique pushed the 165s to 1514 fps.

So, I decided to try the same load in Improved Cases.

Average Velocity came out to 1513 fps. I'm at a loss to explain why the larger capacity didn't loose more fps.

But, I guess it doesn't matter...

[williamiorg]

Ranch Dog and I have teased each other about cast bullets in the .3030AI.
RD was for them and I was against.
RD used a .311" round ball and 10.7 grains of Unique with a small paper patch to hold the powder against the primer. A 1.3cc Lee Dipper.
RD got high velocity, over 2,300 fps as I recall from his 93 grain tound ball with poor accuracy.

My friend Greg Mushial used 173 grain Lasercast bullet for fire forming with a variety of powders. His data is posted at GMDR. Greg's graphs showing fps per grain of powder as he steps up velocity are very useful.
Greg used 9.0 grains of Unique for 1,329 fps from a 20" barrel with a 170 grain cast bullet. Greg got much netter accuracy with the heavier cast bullets and sharper shoulders.

I preferred Accurate Arms no. 2 or Alliant Bullseye for this type of fire forming as the powder burns cleaner does not leave small hard kernals in the chamber when you extract the case. All three of us got a few dimples in the cases when using Unique

[Encore64]

I've completed all my goals on this platform. I'll try the same established data in the Ruger #1 once it's returned from Jack.

I'll stick with Unique for cast bullets. I've used the powder more than any other since 1979. Fine ballistics and accuracy are always expected and received.

With Jacketed Bullets, it seems a 200 fps gain is to be expected with prudent handloads. This is from a 22" Barrel, other lengths may vary.

Five cases were used from start to finish for several days of testing. The shoulder was never resized on the cases.

While I didn't count how many times they were loaded, I'll say case life is excellent. Of course, this is from a brute strong action without the spring that are characteristics of other guns the 30-30 is generally chambered in...

[williamiorg]

One of the fun things about the .30-30AI is a comparison of the various barrel lengths of the standard .30-30.
In a rifle which likes the 160 grain Hornady bullet in the factory .30-30 loads there is a noticeable improvement in accuracy with the FTX bullet.
160 grain Hornady LeverRevolution Factory loads fired from a Winchester Model 94AE Black Shadow carbine and a Buffalo Bill rifle.
20” barrel 2,292 ps
26” barrel 2,378 fps

Handloads from the 26” barrel .30-30 rifle with modern powders such as Hodgdon Varget and Alliant Reloder 15 significantly improve performance.
150 grain bullets at 2,500 fps
170 grain bullets at 2.450 fps

[leftysixgun]

Weather pending,I plan to get out tomorrow and try both 3031 with 110gr V-max and some R-15 with some Hornady 150gr SP bullets. All in my 14” 30-30AI Contender barrel.

[Encore64]

Jul 9, 2023 21:47:52 GMT -5 leftysixgun said:

Weather pending,I plan to get out tomorrow and try both 3031 with 110gr V-max and some R-15 with some Hornady 150gr SP bullets. All in my 14” 30-30AI Contender barrel.

Let us know how that goes...

[boolitdesigner]

Jun 30, 2023 18:54:18 GMT -5 Encore64 said:

A few years back, I purchased a Stainless/Walnut Ruger #1 chambered in 30-30 Winchester. I bought it with the full intention of rechambering to Ackley Improved.

"Improved" means a bit more in a strong Single Shot Rifle.

Clearly, powder capacity is increased when Improved. Unlike Lever Guns, Single Shots don't require the deep seating round or flat nosed bullets. That provides a second advantage.

Lastly, the 30-30 Case is not weak!!! This is another rumor that just won't die. Luckily, TC Contender Enthusiasts have debunked that many times.

All this adds up to a 150 grn SST at 2600 fps in my Henry Single Shot. I figure the Ruger will do the same.

Comments and Suggestions Welcomed...

First, you have an action rated over 50K pressure levels. You have brass (375 Win) rated over that pressure level. You basically have a new cartridge there, that can be loaded to 50K or above. DO NOT look at any Marlin or Winchester load levels for the 30-30 AI because those will be like starting loads. Look at the case capacity and pressure level for a like cartridge to get an idea of what you can do, then start low and work up.

[Encore64]

I agree 100%, except I use regular 30-30 Cases.

I do have some 375 Win Brass, so I may try it.

As many expected from beginning, it's a ballistic twin to the old 300 Savage...

[boolitdesigner]

Paco Kelly had some very interesting data for what you intend to do. Try to find it and read what he has to say.