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Post by handloadingnotes on Aug 16, 2022 12:06:58 GMT -5
Hello, I was wondering if there's ever been a snubnosed revolver chambered in 38 Special but with a the smallest-possible frame and cylinder that is so short it can only hold wadcutters, will bullets seated flush or nearly so. Perhaps a custom made off of a smaller 32 caliber base gun. I've had an idea this kind of gun might make sense today after seeing the Federal HST .38 Special +P (Part # P38HST1S) ammunition [ link] a few years ago. Darned if it isn't a modern backwards wadcutter! Practicality aside, wadcutters are fun in any caliber. And the smallest or largest of something is usually interesting. So the idea has stayed in my head… All I've been able to find so far when searching for wadcutter-only 38 Specials are full-sized guns tuned for PPC competition. Some of them are fantastic, but they're all much bigger than what I was thinking of. Anyone have experience with this kind of thing? |
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JM
.375 Atomic
Posts: 2,454
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Post by JM on Aug 16, 2022 14:10:11 GMT -5
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Post by needsmostuff on Aug 16, 2022 14:18:16 GMT -5
Sounds kind of like the old British Bulldog designs.
I have wondered about the same, short as possible cylinder, but for 45AR.
Make a wicked little pocket pistol.
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owen67
.30 Stingray
Posts: 251
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Post by owen67 on Aug 16, 2022 15:24:33 GMT -5
That linked 380 might work with 38 Super?! And it wouldn’t mandate moon clips BUT they could be used to speed load if designed as such. I know this isn’t what OP wanted with wad cutters but could still allow serious power in smallest package. And since not an auto some heavier blunt boolits could work as well. Neat conversation and thoughts everyone has.
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Post by handloadingnotes on Aug 16, 2022 23:11:47 GMT -5
Thanks for the pointer, I didn't know that little guy existed! This review says the cylinder is 1.3" which is just about perfect. In fact it's just-perfect for the 38 Super owen67 brought up! If the cylinder can take the higher pressure and the bore diameters work out, that does sound like a neat conversion. Another catch is the Taurus 380 taking moon clips. Depending on how much space is cut out for them, there could be major problems. Sounds like the clips are 0.02" thick. Since they snap into the extractor groove, add the 380 ACP's 0.045" thick rim, giving 0.065" space between cylinder and and breech-face. Unfortunately it sounds like a 38 Special's a 0.058" rim would not work. Might need to fabricate a whole new cylinder, or extractor-support, or something. Of course this is all speculation without ever having seen one of these guns. Even without modifications, I wonder what the little 380 case can do if loaded to to a 30% longer overall-length in a revolver. |
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owen67
.30 Stingray
Posts: 251
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Post by owen67 on Aug 17, 2022 9:22:54 GMT -5
Good question on the .380 loaded long? Also, pressure could be bumped to something more like 9mm I’d imagine. 380 is kept down due to so many pistols not being a locked breech. All very interesting ideas that could make a useful and different revolver. Will it do something better than what is available? Debatable, but it would definitely have a different form factor at a given performance. And I guess that smaller frame and cylinder MIGHT print less when concealed.
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Post by handloadingnotes on Aug 19, 2022 2:11:52 GMT -5
Even without modifications, I wonder what the little 380 case can do if loaded to to a 30% longer overall-length in a revolver OK, finally taking a wild stab at answering this using QuickLoad. All these numbers are computer projections that may not be real at all. And they're optimistic too, since it's assuming a solid un-vented 3" barrel with no gap between the cylinder and barrel. Real performance will be worse. .380 Auto case in a 3" solid barrel 147 grain Speer Gold Dot (#4002) 1.2" COAL — might also be a bit optimistic since it leaves only 0.121" grip on the bullet. Bullets pulling under recoil is a real concern with such a light gun. 5.05gr Power Pistol (21,445 PSI) = 855 feet per second (SAAMI max for 380) 5.5gr Power Pistol (25,016 PSI) = 913 feet per second 5.8gr Power Pistol (29,684 PSI) = 979 feet per second 6.2gr Power Pistol (35,065 PSI = 1046 feet per second (9x19 pressure) Sounds like if everything worked out perfectly (it won't!) you could theoretically match the performance of a ubiquitous 9mm automatic shooting factory ammunition out of a 2.5 to 4 inch barrel, the length depending on how far you can exceeded maximum pressure for 380 Auto. Not earth shattering but it does sound useful. Maybe not useful for the amount of work though! One last caution: looks like small revolvers in 9x19 use steel frames. For example the 9mm Ruger LCR uses the steel 357 Magnum frame instead of the lighter Aluminium 38 Special frame. This makes me think the Taurus 380 might not be up to 9x19 pressures. After all 9x19 is so popular I'd expect that frame to be used for a 9x19 revolver if it could be done. |
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Post by ddixie884 on Aug 20, 2022 22:21:53 GMT -5
I like it........
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