A Disappointing Email

[boxhead]

Jim Stroh is doing a 45 Colt conversion on an early S&W M29 and advised that some of the chambers were oversized after he rechambered it. He wasn't able to locate a recessed 44 cylinder so I had to go with a new non-recessed one that he is buying from S&W to rechamber. Not much I can do and I am sure he quite disappointed too.

[razor]

Sounds like a good gunsmith. He was honest with you. I alway like dealing with him.

[boxhead]

Another surprising bit is that I sent a Ron Power oversized hand with the gun to allow Jim to correct the carry up. Jim found the hand soft at RC 12. He hardened and tempered it to RC 50 once fitted. Sometimes schite happens.

[mark]

Feb 18, 2010 9:42:16 GMT -5 boxhead said:

Jim Stroh is doing a 45 Colt conversion on an early S&W M29 and advised that some of the chambers were oversized after he rechambered it.

That's odd. Shouldn't he have known that before he tried to rechamber the cylinder?
Why did you send a Ron Powers hand? Are new hands not available from S&W?
Mark

[Otony]

Ok, I am not slamming anyone, least of all boxhead or Stroh, but I am having trouble wrapping my head around the statement "the chambers were oversized AFTER he rechambered it". Remember, not a slam, but it just sort of boggles the brain.

Where and how did things go wrong? Certainly the chambers were not oversized BEFORE he rechambered it, at least not so much so that it could have affected the resulting chambers. Unless the cylinder was seriously out of spec to begin with (and that scenario should/would/could have been caught BEFORE rechambering) things should not have goune south so badly.

So that leads me to believe that Mr Stroh made an error in machining somehow. Either his machines were not adjusted properly, or his reamer was out of spec. I imagine his fixtures could have shifted as well, but in any case, it is pretty surprising. Its no wonder he is dissapointed. A 'smith with his reputation must really be feeling pretty low about now.

[boxhead]

S&W was out of oversized hands so I went to Ron Power who is well known for making some of the finest gun parts in the industry. I have used many over the years. Apparently one (or more?) got through without HT and was missed in QC. Same can happen at S&W and, in fact, does with entire firearms that go out "bad". I am pleased that Mr. Stroh found, likely with a couple of strokes of a file, that the part was soft and corrected it. I will send the Power's an email just to make them aware of the problem.

The gun sent was a M29, a 44 Mag, so there is no "out of spec" when converting to 45 Colt. In the contract I specified minimum spec chambers which Mr. Stroh does and agreed to. Exerpts from a couple of his emails.

"I cut some chambers oversize, long story, and I do not want to the gun to you this way, especially since you asked about chamber dimensions earlier."

"All the chambers were at the max SAAMI, & one was beyond. I discarded it in a fit of temper and cascade of profanity!"

So, yes, clearly Mr. Stroh made an error which he clearly is not pleased with and he is correcting it to the best of his abilities. Human beings are far from perfect, even those as noted as Mr. Stroh or Ron Power. In the end I will have a fine revolver without a doubt.

[rigby]

Just a query, I understand the benefits of the minimum specs on a SBH conversion but on a Smith is it really that important? The pressures you would run though a Smith wouldnt seem to be as big as factor?

[boxhead]

I want the gun to be put together as precise as possible. Having the tighter chamber keeps the bullet centerline closer to the chamber centerline and the bore centerline. It costs no more to have the rechamber done with the minimum spec reamer.

[mark]

Thanks for clearing-up Jim Stroh's role in that. You are right. We are all human. It is too bad the error occured on a part which is no longer available. That is something to consider when sending a gun to a 'smith (I never gave it a thought before this).
Mark

[Otony]

I have to say that you certainly sent the gun to the right guy, and he did right by you as well, which is what counts in the end. It is too bad you fellows couldn't find another recessed cylinder, but I am quite certain it will be a beautiful revolver.

[brionic]

A test of character is whether a man will admit and take responsibility for a mistake, and what steps he has taken to fix the problem.

Its seems like he acted honorably and honestly.

Now, the next question - is he going to recess the chambers on the new cylinder? I have an old MkII hand ejector that was converted to .45 Colt by this process, but whether this is up to his standards is the question.

[gunzo]

I've had a few reamed holes go oversize and never did find the reason or reasons why. Bet Lee could shed some light on this.

Don't think recessing a non recessed cylinder would work, wouldn't that increase the headspace by the thickness of the rim? Just asking.

[Bowenbuilt]

Feb 19, 2010 1:05:14 GMT -5 boxhead said:

S&W was out of oversized hands so I went to Ron Power who is well known for making some of the finest gun parts in the industry. I have used many over the years. Apparently one (or more?) got through without HT and was missed in QC. Same can happen at S&W and, in fact, does with entire firearms that go out "bad". I am pleased that Mr. Stroh found, likely with a couple of strokes of a file, that the part was soft and corrected it. I will send the Power's an email just to make them aware of the problem.

The gun sent was a M29, a 44 Mag, so there is no "out of spec" when converting to 45 Colt. In the contract I specified minimum spec chambers which Mr. Stroh does and agreed to. Exerpts from a couple of his emails.

"I cut some chambers oversize, long story, and I do not want to the gun to you this way, especially since you asked about chamber dimensions earlier."

"All the chambers were at the max SAAMI, & one was beyond. I discarded it in a fit of temper and cascade of profanity!"

So, yes, clearly Mr. Stroh made an error which he clearly is not pleased with and he is correcting it to the best of his abilities. Human beings are far from perfect, even those as noted as Mr. Stroh or Ron Power. In the end I will have a fine revolver without a doubt.

Well at least he told you. I didn't have the same luck the last time he had one of mine. He didn't offer to do anything about it at all and charged me full price. He will never get another from me. It burns me up everytime I think about it and that was 15 years ago.