? 30-357 mag?

[jsh]

This is just a thought/idea as it seems there is a decent size following of 32-20 folks here.
I am not a fan of a shouldered cartridges in a revolter. But this seems a doable alternative for a lever gun/ revolver combo. This was after pricing 32-20 rifles and then asking how they shot and their glitches.
A marlin 357 rebarreled and chambered to 30-357. Seems to me there would be little if any issues to feeding? No mods to bolt or elevator etc.
Revolter just go to a 30 carbine and your done pretty quick.
Brass is easy to find.
Dies. Easy enough also. All this is is a 30 x221/300 blackout rimmed.
357 max brass trimmed back a bit and then leave a longer neck would also may be an option. A .312 barrel is sure an option but there is a heck of a lot more selection in .308.
Y'all are a bad influence.
Got visions. Get a 30" octagon blank, lop off what you want for your wheel gun. Heck ya could even build a pair of revolters and still have enough for a carbine. Color case hardened frame antiqued color for barrel buffalo or dark grips.
Jeff

[dmize]

I am probably wrong but at least from my muzzleloader shooting,a rifle barrel wont make a pistol barrel,twist is different.

[subsonic]

What you propose is not new. The .357 is just a little shorter than the Whisper, but that is easily fixed by using max brass or shortening the dies.

Back when the forum was discussing a wildcat for the single six I proposed a .32-.38spl loaded with shortened blackout dies.

[AxeHandle]

Gary Reeder uses a .308 barrel on his custom 32-20 (30-20). I've got one in the pipeline that we may get to see before the year is out.. Doing a 327 cylinder for it too. Another option is Reeder's 300GNR. It is is basically a 30 Herrett with improvements to enhance performance in revolvers.

[bradshaw]

Haven't worked with .32-20 in a revolver. As with .44-40 and.38-40, brass is thin. A bullet that grabs the mouth on seating may crush or ruin the case before you know it. .32-20 brass may have decent life if you baby it. Thompson/Center dispensed with the .312 groove, opting for a .308 groove and renaming the cartridge .30-20. Opening the door to pointed bullet in the Contender. Were I dead set on a revolver so-chambered, I chamber it for the Contender version, with .308" groove and 1:10-inch twist. Know this opinion should not influence you.
David Bradshaw

[bradshaw]

Now to contradict what I just said... to walk the plank of theory... See what happens with a 100 or 110 grain spitzer varmint bullet in the .357 necked down to .308. Use actual figures and call it the .308/.357. Anytime you neck down a pistol cartridge the modus operandi is obvious: VELOCITY. Velocity from a revolver requires firm tolerances, especially firm throats and absolute minimum gap. A high cycles-per-second sound wave comes as free baggage.

This is where I would look for elevated velocity from a closed breach----an auto pistol. Such as an .308/10mm.

My very limited experience with the plastic FN 5.7 pistol was dismal. Was it reliable, expensive, and anemic? YES. It didn't do diddly to 1/4" steel at any sort of distance. Accuracy was good for a yawn. A Les Baer 1911 slammed the door on the supersonic 5.7 at 100 yards. My perspective may be jaded, but anything costs that much should kick butt & take names. Anyone calls the 5.7 a survival pistol better have food laid up in advance.
David Bradshaw

[jsh]

I have messed with the 30-20 in a BF and a TC for 20 years. It takes a some what bad rap on several things.
.312 or .308. There isn't enough difference to argue over IMHO.
Jacketed or cast. Well after starting casting about 13 years ago I see no need for a jacketed bullet. A cast bullet out of a straight walled pistol cartridge will do as good if not better than a jacketed. Of course that is with proper alloy and bullet design.
My Ruger buckeye 32 mag/32-20 is doing 1400 with a 140 and 296/H110 load. The bullet was custom design group buy from cast boolits several years back. When working up loads I had a batch of 25 that were once fired rp brass. It has been put through the wringer all of them being reloaded and fl sized 6 times and annealed at the mouth twice. I have 100 pieces of starline that I use now and expect the same if not better.
The above mentioned load will take down hand set rams at 200 meters when hit. The cases just drop out and have no pressure signs of any sort.
I have toted this several times deer hunting but have not gotten one inside of what I want to try. As far distance
As far as cases being weak. Just treat it like hornet brass. It is not as bad as what is let on by folks though.
Not looking at any kind of survival/doomsday rig. Just a neat combo.
FYI to the first comment a projectile has no idea out of what type of action it is fired out of. There are twist used today that are in need of a dire update in rifles and pistols.
Jeff

[subsonic]

I have never been impressed with the 5.7 either, but there is a lot of money to be made selling them.

Maybe if we could get the high octane military ammo it would have impressed the steel more?

[sheriff]

There's a .30/.38-.357 already out there called the .30 Reese. Haven't seen it in a revolver, but have ina Contender. Works similar to the .300 Whisper.

[bradshaw]

Jeff.... I concur there is no noticeable difference between .308 and .312 beyond bullet selection. And that cast lead sidesteps the ambiguities of jacketed. T/C's selection of .308 groove for its ".30-20" was strictly based on jacketed spitzers for silhouette. Performance oriented guys, including 2 Dogs and Martin, respect the .32.

Subsonic.... Reckon the 5.7 thrives on the AP bullet for penetration, a slug with which citizens are considered untrustworthy. As is true of the 9mm Luger, the 5.7 absolutely is bullet dependent. A trail pistol must be rabbit-accurate from half a football field to ride my hip. My limited experience with the FN 5.7 says, while reliable, it ain't rabbit accurate.
David Bradshaw

[jsh]

I was all gungho on the 5.7, then did some homework. IMHO it is nothing more than a modern hornet with a pressure boost. It is a cute little devil if nothing else. I throw it into the pray and spray crowd.
.308 or .312 I have seen no vast difference on paper at any ethical hunting distance. FYI I got in on the 30-20 when the 300 whisper was just getting started. The 30-20/32-20 still looks down on the 32 mag and 327 in a modern steel gun. I think to be the actual original true magnum.
The only reason I even looked at the 30-357 was the cost of a danger lever gun of modern mfg in 32-20.
The 30 Reese nor the 30-357 are anything remotely new as far as ideas. Maybe a shoulder angle or neck length change. Not enough to argue over.
David I have to ask a personal question. How young are you now? I am looking as I type this at a Shooting Steel and Gun Digest Metallic Silhouette shooting and a fair sized library of the ihmsa news. Even have some copies of the old silhouetter around here.
Jeff

[ohnomrbillk]

www.quarterbore.net/forums/showpost.php?s=bf229e423ccb014ec887761c79f27a26&p=12754&postcount=5


Also, as mentioned above,


This potent looking little cartridge was developed by Carson Reece for small game and varmint hunting. It is based on the .357 Magnum case, necked, shortened to 1.165", and slightly tapered. Hornady recently began producing the empty cases, chambered barrels are available from T-C, MGM, and O.T.T., and loading dies can be obtained from Mr. Reece. For additional information, or to purchase dies, contact Mr. Reece at:

[e-mail]

[AxeHandle]

Internet says... September 28, 1944 Check this out:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Bradshaw

[jsh]

So gents help me out here. What are the "do's" and "don'ts" using a bottle neck in a wheel gun.
Jeff

[bradshaw]

Jeff.... as Axehandle indicates, I am 68.

Bought, in a previous century, a Model 53 .22 Jet Smith & Wesson. Six inch barrel. Steel inserts for shooting .22 Long Rifle. The shock wave of the Jet split my ears. Meaningless pain. Frequent stiff case extraction. Much preferred my K-22 for rabbits and grouse. Sold the M-53 without putting holster wear on it. Since a wish list seems to be spilling over, how about a Ruger .357 Maximum, with a new cylinder and barrel in .30/.357 Maximum, or ".30 Maximum" for short? Don't know what it would do that the Maximum doesn't. Bottleneck chamber aside, such a contraption jumps right into the velocity game. Whereas, the Maximum long ago settled a good bullet at respectable velocity.
David Bradshaw