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Post by ChiefTJS on Sept 15, 2012 9:50:48 GMT -5
Ok folks, I'm skeptical about this to say the least which is why I'm asking for opinions.
I have a .45 Colt Redhawk (4.2") and I'm perfectly happy with it as is. I also have an extra Redhawk cylinder (.44Mag). I also have a buddy (don't we all) that said I should have the .44 cylinder reamed out to a .454 Casull or a wildcat .45 of some sort.
I'm not so sure that I want .454 Casull pressures on a .44Mag cylinder. I know folks are dropping in .454 Cylinders from Super Redhawks, but I believe that is special steel with a special heat treat.
Anybody got any ideas on this? Thanks
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Post by whitworth on Sept 15, 2012 10:57:24 GMT -5
Ok folks, I'm skeptical about this to say the least which is why I'm asking for opinions. I have a .45 Colt Redhawk (4.2") and I'm perfectly happy with it as is. I also have an extra Redhawk cylinder (.44Mag). I also have a buddy (don't we all) that said I should have the .44 cylinder reamed out to a .454 Casull or a wildcat .45 of some sort. I'm not so sure that I want .454 Casull pressures on a .44Mag cylinder. I know folks are dropping in .454 Cylinders from Super Redhawks, but I believe that is special steel with a special heat treat. Anybody got any ideas on this? Thanks I am not going to suggest that you do it, just that this was a relatively common practice in the '80s. Speaks volumes of the strength of the Redhawk. While I haven't heard of any failures, I cannot advocate the practice. I think jwp475 had one or two Redhawks converted in this manner to .454. I have a Redhawk that started life as a .45 Colt that is now a .454, but I used the .454 cylinder out of an SRH. |
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Post by kaytod on Sept 15, 2012 12:23:48 GMT -5
The cylinder in the standard redhawk 44 and 45 Colt are 17-4 stainless if memory serves me. The steel in the 454 Super Redhawk is a different metal, ( carpenter 216 ?) which is a higher strength steel.
Original cylinders have been chambered in 6 shot variations with standard 17-4, which has a great strength and elasticity. Unfortunately, this practice worked the elasticity portion of the steel quite a bit, therefore a different alloy was sought to minimize the stress of the elastic limit brought by the bigger cartridges with top end loads and still maintain industry safety margins.
Your standard 45 Colt can be loaded safely to 35,000 in your big Redhawk which is all most folks ever want to grab hold of.
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Post by whitworth on Sept 15, 2012 14:05:30 GMT -5
Carpenter 465. I have the article that Carpenter posted on their website about the SRH cylinder project. They talk about the brutal testing performed before they declared the cylinder adequate for the task at hand. It's worth the read.
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Post by ChiefTJS on Sept 15, 2012 16:16:32 GMT -5
I appreciate the responses. I doubt this will ever come to pass as I personally have no need for more power than the .45 Colt and a 35K load is way more than what I usually load anyhow.
I actually bought the .44mag cylinder thinking I'd have it reamed to a tight chambered .45 Colt but Dave Clements told me I wouldn't really gain anything for the expense. The cylinder was sitting on the bench when my buddy came by and we started talking and...
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shorty500
.327 Meteor
too many dirty harry movies created me!
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Post by shorty500 on Sept 15, 2012 16:19:21 GMT -5
the factory cylinders in .44 and .45 are made from 416 stainless unless changed recently. Both calibers are regardless as safe with loads up to 50kPSI by knowledgable shooters. When Ruger attempted using the .454 in that cylinder material they werent happy with results from firing the 93kPSI proof loads required for the Casull. All reports say its hard to put an exact number as to destruction but the Redhawk cylinder in 416ss dies around 100psi
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Post by kaytod on Sept 16, 2012 4:11:25 GMT -5
Thanks for the correction on the types of metal. I've got them written down in my notes but alas wern't handy. Mind has been on building projects lately and numbers are a jumble....
No intention to mislead. Thanks Whit and Shorty
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Aggie01
.375 Atomic
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Post by Aggie01 on Sept 16, 2012 4:30:44 GMT -5
In my mind, you can do everything you need to do with a .452 bore with .45 Colt cases.
If you need to wring a little more out of your RH, I'd send the whole thing to your favorite gun plumber to fit the 44 cylinder, minimize endshake/headspace & B/C gap, and rechamber the .44 cylinder to tight .45 Colt (.480 chambers). This is assuming your current cylinder runs to the later Ruger standard of about .484 chambers or larger.
You could run this combo with as nasty a load as I would want to pull the trigger on in a standard Redhawk.
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Post by whitworth on Sept 16, 2012 8:11:59 GMT -5
My Redhawk, with .454 cylinder rarely gets fed .454 fodder. I run heavy .45 Colt loads in it and it is lacking nothing IMO.
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jwp475
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Post by jwp475 on Sept 16, 2012 19:52:42 GMT -5
Ok folks, I'm skeptical about this to say the least which is why I'm asking for opinions. I have a .45 Colt Redhawk (4.2") and I'm perfectly happy with it as is. I also have an extra Redhawk cylinder (.44Mag). I also have a buddy (don't we all) that said I should have the .44 cylinder reamed out to a .454 Casull or a wildcat .45 of some sort. I'm not so sure that I want .454 Casull pressures on a .44Mag cylinder. I know folks are dropping in .454 Cylinders from Super Redhawks, but I believe that is special steel with a special heat treat. Anybody got any ideas on this? Thanks I have done this twice and I like the results. I have shot ful;l power factory loaded 454 ammo through them with perfect results. I do not load 454 to the max as it is not needed for any animal that one wants to take |
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greygt
.30 Stingray
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Post by greygt on Sept 16, 2012 21:41:20 GMT -5
I remember reading an article by Mr. Taffin where he wrote an article in the 1991 Jan/feb issue of american handgunner about the conversion gunsmith Andy Cannon did with a 44 SRH to 454 Casull. In that article I belive he said he would shoot factory ammo but not loads for a freedom arms in the converted SRH.
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Post by bigmuddy on Sept 16, 2012 23:48:57 GMT -5
Just my opinion but other than flatter trajectory I don't think you gain all that much with the 454 over what a 45 Colt in a RH is capable of. Maybe when you got to heavier bullets? (360's)
If you want to do something with that extra cylinder, ever think of going the "other" way and having a 45 acp made? Might be a fun option.
Dan
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Snyd
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Post by Snyd on Sept 17, 2012 1:14:10 GMT -5
I put a 454 SRH cylinder in my 4" Redhawk. The way it worked out, after I sold the donor gun, 45 Colt cylinder and some ammo I got with the donor gun, I made 50 bucks on the deal. If I had it to do again and if it would cost me any money, I'd pass. Heavy 45 Colt is plenty and you don't have to deal with SR primers. I've had to deal with light primer strikes shooting DA with CCI 450's, Rem 71/2 and even CCi 400's. I shaved the hammer face, firing pin protrusion is good, slicked up the action, etc. All that combined with F205 primers and now it always goes bang shooting DA. SA has never been a problem. Never a problem with CCI 350's in 45 Colt.
Sure, I can shoot my 355ers at 13-1400, same boolit in 45 colt at 1150. But I'm having troubles keeping them in the case.
But, it is a cool having a 454 4" Redhawk and who knows... I might get a shot at a moose with it in a few days!
Oh, before I did my cylinder swap I emialed Mr. Bowen and asked him about reaming/rechambering the 45 Colt cylinder to a 454. Here's his response...
Dear Sir:
In my view, rechambering a factory 6-shot .45 Colt cylinder to .454 is inviting disaster. The factory 6-shot .454 cylinders ar made of a proprietary heat-treated stainless. Be best to try to find one of the factory .454 cylinders.
Hope this will help; thanks for your interest.
Sincerely yours,
Hamilton S. Bowen
Bowen Classic Arms Corp.
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Post by ChiefTJS on Sept 18, 2012 17:06:07 GMT -5
I appreciate the responses all. I think I've pretty much decided that this would be money down a rat hole for me personally. I certainly see the value of a .454, just not for me. .45 Colt is all I'll ever need, especially as hot as it can be out of a Redhawk.
BigMuddy- I actually considered having the existing cylinder cut for moon clips to give me the .45acp option.
Got a useless .44mag Redhawk cylinder, anybody need one?
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jwp475
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Post by jwp475 on Sept 18, 2012 17:13:48 GMT -5
The first 475 that Bowen ever built was for me and he did not think that the ruger frame would hold up with 420 grain bullets. He furnished a LBT mould for 385 grains. The point is that Hamilton is a bit cautious even when unnecessary
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