45 70 replica ammunition... questions..

[kennisondan]

I am intending to deer hunt during the replica / black powder season with a 45 70 sharps replica from stoeger/ pedersoli IIRC.. I do not have a big problem using modern ammunition with the special tips that operate at long range for some of my shooting, and I can buy those just fine.
I handload and want some suggestions about longer range shooting with replicas and other single shot guns of this ilk.
are we talking about using heavy cast bullets? light for caliber by comparison to the 500 grainers etc ? I was kind of thinking about some 350 grain to 450 gr. cast bullets kind of light for ease of recoil and some speed out the barrel for trajectory sake. I will be shooting iron sights.
Also can you suggest a lightest weight .. and a heaviest weight bullet.. ?
a top speed and a low speed recipe with the normal warnings would be nice.. I will want to shoot short range for familiarity and plinking up to fifty yards, and I will want to have a load to work with to easily shoot 150 or more... depending on what distance would still be ethical to shoot a game animal at with that gun and load.
after some time working with the gun from the bench and especially learning the sights, and the trajectory, I may want to shoot some targets like water filled five gallon cans at much longer ranges.
I understand that any loads or recipes are safe only in your guns, with your components, and with your techiniques and any disclosures are strictly guidelines that I might use within greatly reduced charges and that all responsibility of reloading firing storing ammunition and components safely lies strictly with me and I release any person or entity from any liability at all and agree to hold same harmless in exchange for valuable information and experience shared on this board or through private messages or emails..
(wow that was a mouthful of don't worry .. was it not ?)
lol
dk

[groo]

Groo here
You have a good start 350 to 450 gr maybe 400 as an average.
The loading manuals have the loads you need but try trailboss powder for the light one..

[wickerbill]

Kennisondan, BPCR's are a different bread than a Ruger #1 or a Marlin 1895. They don't have the same twist rate and even though the cartridge says 45-70 Gov., they're not the same animal. These guns where designed for low and slow with heavy bullets. I've tried what your wanting to do and it won't work at long range. Don't try and reinvent the wheel here.

As almost all the replica Sharps rifles I've seen, yours most likely has a 1:18 twist. This is meant to stabilize heavy bullets(475gr. and up). For your short range loads, out to 100 yards, you can get away with 300 gr, bullets. Past that range you will run into tumbling projectiles. LONG RANGE IS A DIFFERENT GAME.

All I can tell you is what works for me in my Dixie/Pedersoli Sharps. I always use the black stuff and I always use a heavy lead bullet with a lot of SPG in the grooves. My primary load consists of a 525 gr Hock nose pore bullet(semi spitzer) ahead of 67.5 grs of Swiss 1.5fg black powder. These are loaded in Winchester cases(all the same lot) with Fed. LRM primers. This load also shot good in my trap door Springfield. With this load, I can shoot 1.5 inch groups at 100 yards all day long from cross sticks(WIPING THE BORE AFTER EVERY FIVE SHOTS).

I hope this doesn't offend you or come off as high handed. I'm just trying to tell you what works for me.

I don't know if you have ever loaded with black powder before, but you can't use the same loading techniques as with smokeless powders. Smokeless loads will work, but they need to be kept down to 45-120BP speed levels(1400 fps).
Bill

[kennisondan]

Heck guys : I had completely overlooked that the trailboss was the smokeless name I was looking for ..
and had not considered the rate of twist at the point of posting until now, at least.
I was thinking of my marlin 1895 cowboy and ruger ! 45 70s and not replica twist rates, actually being best with black powder or at least shots with black powder speeds and weights... that is an easy mistake to make when you have not really sat and thought about it.. I am most thankful for the great advice and insights I get here and around other sites when I get to go there.. this site has been a god send to me in my six gun pursuits.. so I posted here with this question..
WICKERBILL : I recall you always have given sound and honest informed advice.. there is no such thing as .. whatever that word was you used ... lol..
I am going to research pretty much exactly your loadings and will follow your lead in this venture.. I would crave more information on the replica shooting.. I intend to make a go of it in real fashion and welcome the information you are putting out... I need sources for all the goodies too, if you have time to put that out, if not I promise I will find it for myself, it is just time is kind of short these days as I must have gotten a lot older these last couple o three years.. more than three for sure.. feels like.
I seek all the knowlege any reader/responder practitioner has to offer whether it is a list of sources, blackpowder recipes for loads, what to look for in bullet hardness, and how to use the sights that are on the gun or whether to replace them with tang sights at this point or at some future point in time.
thanks again..
I have a little reading to do and have to work tomorrow, darn it.
gonna re read that post first and save it to my files though..
dan kennison - "nouveau noir afficionado in the making.. "--oh well I just want to learn a little and shoot a lot.. lol