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Post by sixshot on Jun 23, 2017 12:21:07 GMT -5
One of the things I really enjoyed about shooting USPSA matches was the moving, swinging, sliding, disappearing targets, that was a challenge & a lot of fun. A couple of my Montana whitetails were shot moving & there's no way I could have done that without firing thousands of rounds at moving targets including Texas Stars, Polish Plate Racks, etc, all double action with a well tuned S&W revolver. Speaking of Taran Butler, he didn't look like an athletic guy at all but stick a limited or open gun in his hands & he was a Ballerina on roller blades!
Dick
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gjn
.30 Stingray
Posts: 491
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Post by gjn on Jun 23, 2017 12:57:34 GMT -5
The well respected guide who shoot the bear with a 9mm was asked, " If you knew you were going to run into that bear would you have taken something else?" His answer was, " Hell yes, a different trail!"
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Post by bula on Jun 27, 2017 8:32:17 GMT -5
I love these bear/bear gun threads, ya know. You throw all of the opinions into the ole mental blender and strain out a nugget or two of good info each time. To someone with less interest am sure it seems like we are only re-hashing the same thing, the same way, blah blah,etc.. not. Years ago thought the various pepper sprays were a waste, a joke. I have come to believe that they work. That I own none is because it is still a one shot only thing. I don't mean ya get one shot of spray, have no idea how many shots, bursts of spray you get from a can. I mean they deter bears, but what else ? No warning shot, no ability to handle other threats, at distance, can't put game on the campfire, etc.. a big piece of your belt space taken. I would buy some and pack if required by law,as in no firearms, grumbling the whole way.
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Post by magnumwheelman on Jun 27, 2017 9:51:43 GMT -5
I've never bought the spray, & always wondered if "pepper" was the best deterrent for a bear... certainly there has to be something more offensive to a bear... perhaps the SIL's perfume... I can't breath around that stuff
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Post by mart on Jun 27, 2017 11:21:03 GMT -5
I can say pepper spray works extremely well in the vast majority of cases on humans. I have deployed it dozens of times in inmate altercations or to gain control of non-compliant or assualtive inmates. From my training in bear intervention it also is highly effective on bears. I've not had to use it myself but would without hesitation.
I would not suggest one go into bear country armed only with pepper spray. While it is likely to work, just like with humans, it doesn't always work. I've known officers and inmates who were completely unaffected by it but they were the exceptions, not the rule. Most of us end up barfing up a lung.
Pepper spray is not as some believe ground up pepper flakes in an aerosol form. This is from Wikipedia. "The active ingredient in pepper spray is capsaicin, which is a chemical derived from the fruit of plants in the Capsicum genus, including chilis. Extraction of oleoresin capsicum (OC) from peppers requires capsicum to be finely ground, from which capsaicin is then extracted using an organic solvent such as ethanol. The solvent is then evaporated, and the remaining waxlike resin is the oleoresin capsicum. An emulsifier such as propylene glycol is used to suspend OC in water, and pressurized to make it aerosol in pepper spray."
It causes inflammation of the mucous membranes in the eyes, nose, throat and lungs. The affect on the eyes is momentary (several seconds) blindness or greatly reduced vision. This may account for the bears in Dr. White's stats that appeared to continue the charge but only knocked the persons down and continued on their course of travel.
Make no mistake about it, being armed is wise in a bear encounter. Some attacks happen so quickly, one's only recourse is to take lethal action if possible. Other bear encounters develop over a matter of minutes and give one a chance to evaluate the bear's behavior. A great many OC failures can be attributed to operator error. I've watched numerous videos, some attempting to discredit OC, where the user was incompetent in the use of the spray. OC is extremely wind and distance sensitive. Trying to use the spray at 75-100 feet is futile.
I am not advocating for OC as a replacement for firearms, only interjecting my observations. I never go afield without a firearm. I don't always have OC but I do carry it frequently. All of my guys carry both during the course of their daily duties.
My apologies to the OP for taking this off track of his original question. Sixshot answered the question best with his response.
I usually get to the range at least a couple of times during my two week R&Rs and frequently I see guys, new to Alaska, many of whom are shooting a handgun for the first time, show up with far more gun than they can wield accurately. I shudder to think that many of these guys are going afield armed with a large bore handgun and luck for protection rather than a shootable handgun with which they have accuracy and ability.
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Post by bula on Jun 27, 2017 11:34:30 GMT -5
Awareness and whatever you can do in the way of deterence still tops the list. Pay attention ! If your first inkling of bad things coming is the bear incoming at 20ft.. Time to call on GOD, but ya, keep on keeping on. Fight.
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