Original Colt SAA in .44 S&W American....

[bobwright]

I've been reading on several forums concerning the first Colt New Model Army Model submitted to the Army for evaluation in 1871~1872. Sveral statements have been made that this was not a .45 Colt but rather chambered for .44 S&W (later to become the .44 S&W American) and was rejected for its caliber, the Army stipulating the new gun be a .45 caliber. I am trying to find any documentation of this. Anybody offer any help?

Bob Wright

[taffin]

Aug 6, 2013 19:58:47 GMT -5 bobwright said:

I've been reading on several forums concerning the first Colt New Model Army Model submitted to the Army for evaluation in 1871~1872. Sveral statements have been made that this was not a .45 Colt but rather chambered for .44 S&W (later to become the .44 S&W American) and was rejected for its caliber, the Army stipulating the new gun be a .45 caliber. I am trying to find any documentation of this. Anybody offer any help?

Bob Wright

THE S&W AMERICAN ARRIVED IN 1869, TWO YEARS BEFORE THE TESTS, NOT LATER. I HAVE HEARD THE FIRST COLT SUBMITTED WAS .44 RIMFIRE, POSSIBLY .44 COLT OR .44 S&W AMERICAN CENTERFIRE. THE FIRST PRODUCTION COLT SAA SERIAL #1 WAS IN .45 COLT.

[bobwright]

According to historian Roy Jinks of Smith & Wesson, the first S&W revolver submitted, ca. 1867 or so, was .44 rimfire, the .44 Henry, I believe. This was prompted rejected by the Army and S&W simply reworked the firing pin to centerfire and resubmitted the revolver.

Statements have been made that the .44 S&W (.44 S&W American) was the standard Army handgun round at the time. Yet from what I've read, the .44 S&W was not a popular round with the Army. All such cartridges were Martin primed, none were made with Benet cup (ca. 1871) primers. Frankford Arsenal was producing at least three handgun cartidges prior to that, including the .44 Colt and .50 Remington c.f.

What puzzles me is why wasn't the first Colt submitted in .44 Colt if not .45 Colt?

[Frank V]

Were the first .44 CF ctgs submitted inside primed? I have read the .45-70 was a CF, but inside primed at the start & changed later?

Interesting thread, I'm staying tuned.

[bobwright]

All centerfire cartridges of the period were more or less primed as they are today. The type of primer varied, but they were reloadable, as demanded by the users of the day. The Army did not consider these primers sufficiently waterproof, so military ammunition produced at Frankfore Arsenal used some type of inside priming. Also, rimfire ammunition was not considered reliable enough, though both the .46 r.f. and .50 r.f. were in use for a short time in the military.

Martin primers soon lost favor in the Army because the anvil was often blown up into the bore of the gun when fired. The Benet primer was used up until about 1891 or so.


Bob Wright

[CraigC]

The 1871-1872 Open Top was designed in 1871 and submitted to the army in late 1871 or early 1872 I believe. Except a few prototypes, all Open Tops were .44 Henry rimfire. This was because of the proliferation of ammunition. The army actually favored the .44Colt centerfire cartridge of the 1860 Richards conversion. The Open Top was rejected, as the Dept. of Ordinance wanted a .45 caliber centerfire cartridge and a solid frame, among other things. William Mason designed the SAA .45Colt in only a few months and it was adopted in late 1872.

[bigbore45colt]

Colt SAA s/n 5 was also a 45 Colt. I had the opportunity to handle it when it was for sale at the Tulsa gun show. Priced at $225K, it was a bit outside of my price range

BB45

[jayhawker]

Interesting story about serial #1 SAA. Sold 15-20 yrs ago at auction for a very high price. Collectors thought buyer was crazy. Buyer then sent it to Uberti and had exact miniatures made and sold them for relatively high prices. Once Uberti was finished using #1 as a model, original buyer then sold it and laughed all the way to the bank.