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Post by dlhredfoxx on Jan 4, 2012 17:47:36 GMT -5
I've got two Old Model Vaquero's in 45 LC. One prints high left at 20 yds, the other low right at 20 yds, pretty much across the board regardless of loads. Everyone tells me to "file the sights". But WOW that makes me nervous. Anyone done this before, or know someone who does it (eg: gunsmith). I'd sure like to get these hitting point of aim at 20 yards without screwing up the sights permantently, or paying an arm and a leg to get it done. Any advise would be appreciated.
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dmize
.401 Bobcat
Posts: 2,825
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Post by dmize on Jan 4, 2012 18:03:58 GMT -5
I had to "adjust" all 6 of mine. Right or wrong this is how I did it. I tried a bunch of reloads with the bullet I wanted to use,tried different loads untill I found the one that grouped the best and then changed the sights to bring that group to POA. I tried and tried and tried to turn the barrels to no avail so I bent the front sights to bring them over and then filed to bring them up. Just be very very careful with the bending,the blades are soldered to the barrel and can be snapped loose. BIG WARNING!!! IT doesnt take very much movement of the front sight to change POA. If you have access to a frame fixture and a barrell wrench it is easier to do.
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Post by triggernosis on Jan 4, 2012 19:43:33 GMT -5
dmize, You said you tried to turn the barrels to no avail - did you use a frame fixture and barrel wrench?
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dmize
.401 Bobcat
Posts: 2,825
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Post by dmize on Jan 4, 2012 20:18:20 GMT -5
I should add that all of mine shot to the left ie. tightening the barrel to correct problem. I dont have access to a fixture or wrench or anyone close that has one. I bored a hard maple board to fit the barrel and then rosined and squeezed it in a 20 ton press at work and attempted to use a tight fitting board inside the frame to turn it. I pushed untill I was uncomfortable with the pressure and it didnt turm at all. So I just tweaked the front sight.
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Post by triggernosis on Jan 5, 2012 8:28:24 GMT -5
I understand. I had thought of trying that same procedure with my Cimarron, but was afraid I'd mess something up so dropped it off at the 'smith just yesterday for him to adjust the sights. Mine shoots a bit to the left, too.
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dmize
.401 Bobcat
Posts: 2,825
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Post by dmize on Jan 5, 2012 8:48:50 GMT -5
I would have done the same thing if I would have had the option.
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Post by dlhredfoxx on Jan 5, 2012 9:52:49 GMT -5
Thanks for all the feedback guys. Guess I'll be taking mine to the "smith" to dial them in. I can't stand a gun that won't hit point of aim at 20 yards and I'm tired of compensating. My son and I carry these two 45 LC Vaqueros as trail arms/side arms when archery hunting the back country and I'm sure I won't remember to "compensate" if I ever have to draw and fire quickly at something with teeth and claws that has identified one of us as it's next easy meal.
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Post by dale53 on Jan 5, 2012 12:14:04 GMT -5
Some years ago, I bought a 4 5/8" Vaquero in .45 Colt. Windage was perfect at 25 yards but it shot low. That was good, it indicated that the front sight was too high. Spreading the work over three range sessions (eyes can change a bit from day to day) I carefully filed the front sight down until I was "right on" at 25 yards.
I later bought a 5½" Bisley Vaquero and discovered, right out of the box, that it was sighted perfectly at 25 yards (POA and POI coincided). You can hardly get better than that.
I have a Cimarron 4 3/4" barreled .44 Special and it's fixed sights are off several inches at 25 yards. I'll have to turn the barrel on that one (plus a bit of filing).
This admittedly limited experience has pretty much turned me off to fixed sighted guns for using purposes. I much prefer both the sight picture and ease of use of adjustable sights.
Dale53
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Post by dlhredfoxx on Jan 5, 2012 12:52:57 GMT -5
I hear ya Dale53 on the struggles of fixed sights. These two Vaqueros are my only fixed sight singles, the rest are adjustable. The thing I do like a bout fixed on these two guns is that they take a real beating in the backcountry and I dont have to worry about rear sights getting torn up, off or at the least knocked out of alignment... I could just leave them as is as I've learned to compensate for each one at the range, I'm just afraid I'll forget if I'm shooting the high left or low right one at the moment of truth since they are both identical visually. I'm taking them to the smith.
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Post by triggernosis on Jan 5, 2012 15:19:22 GMT -5
Here's "how they're made" - watch at about the 3:36 time mark to see how easy they make turning that barrel look. youtu.be/qYOJa8ZNxmEApparently, it isn't that easy to tweak huh, dmize?
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dmize
.401 Bobcat
Posts: 2,825
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Post by dmize on Jan 5, 2012 16:35:45 GMT -5
Never tried my Uberti,but Rugers are definately different.
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ejc
.240 Incinerator
Posts: 25
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Post by ejc on Jan 5, 2012 20:17:07 GMT -5
"I understand. I had thought of trying that same procedure with my Cimarron, but was afraid I'd mess something up so dropped it off at the 'smith just yesterday for him to adjust the sights. Mine shoots a bit to the left, too. "
I have both a Cimarron Bisley and an Uberti Regulator and they both shot a little left. Since I don't like the "V" rear notch, I decided to make it square like on my Colt SAA. I used an old points file endwise since it was what I had and was the right thickness to fit in the top of the "V". After I squared the sight, I went to the range with the load I shoot in both guns and fired a group and then filed the right side of the notch to move the POI to the right. I went slow so it took two or three times to get it right. After I had it right, I blued it with a blue pen and you can't tell it was ever done unless you are looking for it. They both shot low also so I filed the front sight during the same range session. I now have a much nicer sight picture and you can't tell the difference from the sight picture on my Colt SAA.
E. J.
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Post by dale53 on Jan 6, 2012 1:08:20 GMT -5
ejc; I have been putting off "Regulating" the sights on my Cimarron for far too long. I have been planning to regulate the sights exactly as you have done. It's good to know that someone has already plowed that field for me (LOL).
Thanks for sharing your experiences (mine shoots low, left, also). Dale3
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Post by scorchedearth on Jan 6, 2012 2:12:43 GMT -5
When it comes to fixed sights, especially on single actions, a lot of the point of impact can be changed by changing stocks and changing height and strength of the grip. For example, a bear hug type grip can easily make the gun shoot low. Pay attemtion to how you address the trigger. We can develop bad habits that will put that muzzle off without even realizing it. Recoil also has a lot do with where a bullet hits. A heavy load can torque that single action, and send the bullet off. A while ago, PMC made a short run of heavy +P .45 Colt. With Pachmayr grips, they would torque the gun to the point that the bullet landed significantly to the left. It wasn't an issue with sights-it had to do with grips that were not suitable for my hand. Guess I'm saying once you mess with it the deed is done, and you live with the consequences. Much easier to try new bullets, powders, stocks, and watch your technique. Just my 2 cents.
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carl
.327 Meteor
Posts: 546
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Post by carl on Jan 6, 2012 20:10:30 GMT -5
Those with "windage" issues should surf over to Mr. Hamilton Bowen's web site. He's graciously shared some "homeboy" solutions to your troubles. I cannot recall the exact topic but it's something about "barrel turning"........
Of course, heh-heh, we Blackhawk shooters have it easy.........
Carl
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