Gun writers of old.

[turbo]

Dont read stuff like this in any of the gun mags!

I read this in some other gun forum and wonder if anyone has any imput on the matter....discuss.

Jack O'Connor was a drunk and a blowhard. He killed a lot more game with his Remington typewritter than he did with anything else. He was banned from the Winchester writers seminars for being unsafe and poining a loaded shotgun at Elmer Keith. Keith told him that if he ever did it again, drunk or no, that he would kill him. Keith went to the head of Winchester and got O'Connor banned from all future Winchester events. O'Connor hated Keith until his death. Charlie Askins also told O'Connor that he would kill him if he ever got the chance and if anybody would have done it, it would have been Askins.

[taffin]

DON'T BELIEVE EVERYTHING YOU READ ON FORUMS.

[brettov]

Never heard any of that before.

[aciera]

Doesn't sound like many English teachers I had. 'Course we didn't have the internet when I was young.

[boxhead]

If I were making a "blowhard list" Askins and Keith would land far, far closer to the top of that list than O'Connor, without question.

[Len]

I am and always have been a Keith fan my hunting experiences have reinforced his teachings.

I personally never liked O'Connor while there is no question he was a very competent writer there was something about his message that never set well with me. I would not have liked him even if Keith had never written a word. In truth there was something about the way he wrote that made me dislike the man more so than the message. BUT THAT'S ME AND EVERYONE IS ENTITLED TO THEIR OPINION!

From the people I have known in the firearms industry Keith and O'Connor genuinely did not like each other. I too have heard some pretty wild stories about exchanges between them. I am sure the publishers loved the controversy. Over time things do get exaggerated but I have been told by JD Jones that they kept the two separate at events they attended.

As far as Askin's read his book he makes a statement "the timely death of Jack O'Connor". His feud went back to his father being fired and O'Connor taking his place. If anyone could and would have killed O'Connor he would be at the top of the list. But I seriously doubt he would risk going to prison.

[joej]

Well, boxhead, you’re sure entitled to your opinion but I know I surely wouldn’t insinuate that either Keith or Askins were blowhards or even mention their names in the same sentence using the term “blowhard”. One should go by the ole adage of “If you’ve done it – it ain’t bragging”. Askins and Keith both “done it” and were the real deals and there are very few, if any, men in the USA today that have done or could do what they were doing 80 years ago – that’s why maybe some dislike them, as they couldn’t walk but maybe a step or two in their shoes on a 20 mile forced march. As for O'Connor, never liked his style of writing, so I never spent any time reading his articles or learning anything about the man, so I have no comment to make of him. Having graduated from the 92nd session of the BP Academy I made it my business to learn a little about Bill Jordan & Charlie Askins. Most here have read and studied ole Elmer’s works and his life. For those that don’t know much of Askins, I just went to Google and found these articles – there’s several but these two will give you a little insight to this man.

www.darkcanyon.net/The_Legend_Of_Charley_Askins.htm
findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0BTT/is_143_23/ai_56221628/

[boxhead]

No insinuation at all. I have read their books, their articles and their "business practices/ethics" which, in total, have formed my view. Which, of course, is just mine as you wrote. Nothing more.

[Fowler]

Eh part and parcel of the whole writer gig is the "competition". Some guys were good friends who barbed each other just for good print, sometimes obvious (Taffin and Venturino) but more often not. Yea some detest each other to the bone and some just don't really respect each others way of going about the same job as they do. Some isolate themselves out on a island due to their own ethics and values to the point no one else can measure up or even work with them.

There are a few I know lie in just about every article they write about what they have done in the field with such and such gun but I still enjoy reading their work.

Just part of the trade of being a writer for any sport....

[sixshot]

In the book "Letters from Elmer Keith" Elmer mentions a couple of serious run ins with O'Connor, the incident where Jack points the loaded shotgun at him is one.
I grew up reading every word of Jack O'Connor's & was a real believer in the 270 cartridge (still am actually) but he wrote an article once telling about the difficulty of obtaining a sheep tag in old Mexico, he said you could take your chances & appy for many years or if you knew the right people it was no problem, he stated tht HE knew the right people & that really set me off, never cared for him after that.
Askins was a rough customer, no doubt about it, & he seemed to like poking holes in people 4-5 times a week, kind of kept him in practice I guess. While I didn't care for all the killing I did enjoy his writing style.
Anyone thats lived a life time of guns or of writing has a strong opinion, that kind of comes with the territory, it also comes with first hand knowledge about what works or doesn't work, some of these gentlemen were controversional because they did things on a normal basis that many others couldn't duplicate, therefore many figured them to be liars.
The only gun writer I've ever known of that didn't get bad mouthed by somebody was Skeeter, & perhaps Bill Jordan, they seemed to be universally liked & respected by everyone. Almost everyone else seems to get questioned from time to time about either their writing style or their first hand knowledge.
There's one handgun writer who constantly writes about shooting many head of big game, over & over & over, many head of big game (with sixguns) not only many head but with many different sixguns, yet you never see anything but the same couple of animals, month after month (strange) if you're a gun writer & you're doing it with a sixgun, wouldn't you show a photo of the "many head of big game & the sixgun?) Not a mule deer, an elk, a moose, an antelope or a bear, strange, or is it?

Dick

[taffin]

The only gun writer I've ever known of that didn't get bad mouthed by somebody was Skeeter, & perhaps Bill Jordan, they seemed to be universally liked & respected by everyone.

I WOULD THIS WERE TRUE BUT UNFORTUNATELY IT ISN'T. THERE ARE FOLKS WHOSE GREATEST JOY IS RIPPING OTHERS APART EVEN SKEETER AND BILL.

[tullymars]

It happens in all walks of life and any profession.

[sixshot]

Actually I do remember one person going after Bill Jordan.... & it was Charlie Askins, must have been a slow month or something & he didn't have anything important to write about so he decided to go after several other gun writers. First it was Jack O'Connor, he hammered him pretty hard & then started in on Eleanor, I think he called her some German name, not sure. After that it was Elmer's turn, he started in on Elmer's 600 yd shot & pounded on it pretty hard, then it was all 6' 6" of Bill Jordan that got knocked around, he talked about how fast Bill was with a sixgun but kind of poo-pooed the fact that he had never killed a man, he was pretty certain that you had to kill somebody to be a "real" man I guess. Don't remember which gun rag this was in, someone here will know about it I'm sure.

Dick

[aciera]

I always liked Askins fathers writing a lot more. Many writers have to write SOMETHING, or they don't get a paycheck.
That is the sad fate of many magazines today, they are more gun porn than anything else.

[Gary @ R&G]

I liked his stuff. And Elmers, Skeeter's, and Askins. I read the same disparaging crap about Skelton. Hell if we critiqued all the writings of the members of this forum many of us would be labeled as blowhards and know it alls.

Bottom line is who cares. They are all gone as we all will be someday. I prefer not to malign the dead.