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Post by x101airborne on Jan 10, 2020 9:09:00 GMT -5
I loaded 50 rounds as a test batch. Now I get to pull 45 of them.
New Starline Cases
Standard CCI LP primers. (1st mistake)
Starting book load of HS-6 (2nd mistake)
Hornady 180 XTP hollow point
Firm crimp
These were to be for my GP100 as a general plinking / possible short range encounter with small hogs. I was looking for 900 fps or so. Didn't come close. Tons of unburned powder left over; in fact enough to tie the weapon up requiring cleaning. I had never loaded HS-6 in pistol cases prior to this. I plan on using magnum primers and a near top charge levels hoping to up the pressure and get this powder to burn more completely. I will work up with a chronograph and watch for pressure signs intently but wont rely on them as I don't think I will get any signs at anything but stupid ridiculous levels for the 44 Special. I don't know, might just drop back to Unique.
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Post by bula on Jan 10, 2020 9:28:13 GMT -5
No experience with HS-6, others here like it a lot and can help you trouble shoot. That 180gr HP leaves a lot of empty space ! I do use the XTP in 180 and 200grs. Prefer the 200 gr. A number of people now market DEWC's or Full wadcutters. More efficient. Luck.
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Post by dougader on Jan 10, 2020 9:28:29 GMT -5
HS6 never worked well for me with reduced loads, either. The only success with it I can point to is in 357 mag with mag primers and near max loads with a firm crimp.
In 9mm, I could never get a clean burn, even with +P loads. I'm guessing the case tension and crimp were never enough to get a good burn going.
IMO, Unique would be the better choice in 44 Spl. Be advised, loading the GP100/44 Spl over normal book max (15,500 psi) is not recommended.
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Post by kevshell on Jan 10, 2020 9:46:42 GMT -5
Call Hodgdon. I had a very good call with the Tech support line the other day about 454 and HS-6. I have had very good luck with 240 gr XTPs in the 454 with HS-6 but for the recipe I was looking at he said "bad idea." Took all of 10 minutes with the explanation of why it was a bad idea. Personally I like HS-6 but 44 Special and unique just seem to go together.
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Post by x101airborne on Jan 10, 2020 10:00:50 GMT -5
HS6 never worked well for me with reduced loads, either. The only success with it I can point to is in 357 mag with mag primers and near max loads with a firm crimp. In 9mm, I could never get a clean burn, even with +P loads. I'm guessing the case tension and crimp were never enough to get a good burn going. IMO, Unique would be the better choice in 44 Spl. Be advised, loading the GP100/44 Spl over normal book max (15,500 psi) is not recommended. I never never never load outside the book. I own about 5 or 6 44 mags for heavy social work. The GP100 is purely for a comfortable carry option that doesn't pull down my pants. I don't load 38+P, I own a 357 mag, etc. You can tell my cautiousness in that I start with the "book starting load" and work up. I may suck at typing but I like having the ability. |
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Post by x101airborne on Jan 10, 2020 10:04:53 GMT -5
Call Hodgdon. I had a very good call with the Tech support line the other day about 454 and HS-6. I have had very good luck with 240 gr XTPs in the 454 with HS-6 but for the recipe I was looking at he said "bad idea." Took all of 10 minutes with the explanation of why it was a bad idea. Personally I like HS-6 but 44 Special and unique just seem to go together. Could you explain what the tech said about your load that made it a bad idea? Is there any correlation to watch for in other cartridges? |
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Post by bula on Jan 10, 2020 10:05:58 GMT -5
I'd be looking at CFE-P or Power Pistol. Went down the , how low can you go path, for a friend. Think I deep seated that 180gr XTP for him. Not sure if I kept a copy of the data, or just a note in with the ammo to him. Will look later.
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Post by kevshell on Jan 10, 2020 10:20:24 GMT -5
Call Hodgdon. I had a very good call with the Tech support line the other day about 454 and HS-6. I have had very good luck with 240 gr XTPs in the 454 with HS-6 but for the recipe I was looking at he said "bad idea." Took all of 10 minutes with the explanation of why it was a bad idea. Personally I like HS-6 but 44 Special and unique just seem to go together. Could you explain what the tech said about your load that made it a bad idea? Is there any correlation to watch for in other cartridges? It was a weight of bullet, capacity and ignition issue. 454 is a large case and I would guess the issue would be "less" of an issue with a special case. I was asking about 335gr bullets (heavy) with HS-6. Heavy bullets require more oomph. The capacity with the ideal volume of HS-6 would leave too much space leading to potentially poor ignition. (And I hope I regurgitated that properly) |
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Post by 500fksjr on Jan 10, 2020 10:20:51 GMT -5
I loaded 50 rounds as a test batch. Now I get to pull 45 of them. New Starline Cases Standard CCI LP primers. (1st mistake) Starting book load of HS-6 (2nd mistake) Hornady 180 XTP hollow point Firm crimp These were to be for my GP100 as a general plinking / possible short range encounter with small hogs. I was looking for 900 fps or so. Didn't come close. Tons of unburned powder left over; in fact enough to tie the weapon up requiring cleaning. I had never loaded HS-6 in pistol cases prior to this. I plan on using magnum primers and a near top charge levels hoping to up the pressure and get this powder to burn more completely. I will work up with a chronograph and watch for pressure signs intently but wont rely on them as I don't think I will get any signs at anything but stupid ridiculous levels for the 44 Special. I don't know, might just drop back to Unique. HS 6 is fine with heavier bullets...Try a 240/250 hard cast and 8.0 grns of HS6/850 fps. I use winchester large pistol an Starline brass ...In my GP 100 or my Charter Arms Bulldog. fwiw |
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Post by x101airborne on Jan 10, 2020 10:24:41 GMT -5
Thanks!
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Post by webber on Jan 10, 2020 10:46:16 GMT -5
If you used Hornady data, and I looked at it, it listed 10.4 grains as maximum. This is what I would have done based on what I know about the 44 Special and Hornady's data.
It is within SAAMI Specs on pressue which makes it safe for any sound 44 Special. Even the Charter Arms and Colt SAA.
Since the 10.4 grains ran a little over 900 fps from their gun I would have loaded the maximum load and tried it first because 900 or somewhat over with a 180 grain bullet is light to begin with.
Then if I couldn't abide by that load I would have dropped down slightly and tried those. Letting the performance be judged by arbitrator Judge Target as I pleaded my case before him with different senarios based on different charges based on the various level of load levels I Would try.
With common sense being the presenter of forensic evidence as to how low I would go based on 900 ps or somewhat over is soft to begin with.
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Post by junebug on Jan 10, 2020 11:23:41 GMT -5
I don't like light bullets in .44 special , preferring the 240 gr range of bullets. They just seem to shoot better and hit harder, and I like them at 900 to 1100 fps. Like throwing rocks at the barn door . That smaller throwing size rock pops and bounces off the door, that fist size rock WHOPS and moves the door, same principle.
HS6 seems to work best with heavy bullets at the upper end data , some of my books call for mag primers.
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Post by bradshaw on Jan 10, 2020 12:11:24 GMT -5
.... loaded 50 rounds as a test batch. Now I get to pull 45 of them.
New Starline Cases
Standard CCI LP primers. (1st mistake)
Starting book load of HS-6 (2nd mistake)
Hornady 180 XTP hollow point
Firm crimp
These were to be for my GP100....
----x101airborne
*****
x101airborne.... there are fine .44 180 grain JHP bullets, none of which I would think to push at the speed of a shopping cart. I don’t even think of them as .44 Special bullets. Cranked up in .44 Mag, they play hard. Specifically among these bullets, Federal’s 44B 180 JHP, which looks just like the Sierra 180 Jacketed Hollow Cavity but is made by Federal; the Sierra 180 JHC; and Hornady 180 XTP. The bullets impress me as configured for performance in .44 Mag.
Hodgdon HS-6 is an excellent medium burn powder for moderate loads with cast 240 grain .44s. Seems HS-6 wants some holdback----bullet inertia----for smooth ignition. I have used HS-6 under the Sierra .45 185 JHP in .45 ACP,----an entirely different cartridge and environment----with excellent accuracy @ 100 yards.
For any sort of shooting with .44 Special, and wanting a jacketed bullet, I’d look for Hornady’s pre-XTP 200 JHP, or its near identical twin Nosler 200 JHP. However, your happiness with .44 Special may sleep under a tree until you work with a cast 240 SWC seated over a fast powder in the zone of Winchester 231 (or Hodgdon HP-38, which is 231). Believe you’ll find a good cast 240 SWC accuracy and performance, with a good velocity-to-pressure cushion.
David Bradshaw
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Post by apolitical45 on Jan 10, 2020 12:25:58 GMT -5
I have used HS-6 for 38+p, 357 mag, 41 mag and 45 Colt. I don't think I'll use it again in 357, but with SWC's over 150gr.'s it's great in the 38+p. In 41 mag I would use it with 200-220gr. SWC's, but I like 4227 for that. It REALLY worked in my 6.5" NMBH .41 mag pushing the Lee 240gr. SWC. The 45 Colt worked well using at least a 250gr. RNFP and a minimum of 11.0 gr.'s, which is .5 gr.'s over Hodgdon's manual. For me, HS-6 is a decent powder for relatively heavy projectiles in revolver cases. I've loaded most of my 44spl.'s with Universal. The suggestions of CFE and Power Pistol are great and Titegroup or AutoComp might work as well. It's tough to argue with Unique and it's 110+ year relationship with the 44 Special.
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Post by eagle1899 on Jan 10, 2020 16:12:20 GMT -5
My only 44 Special is a Ruger Bisley Flat Top Midframe. With that said(Ruger Midframe Strength), these are the loads I have come to shoot out of it. 240 SWC 6.0 grains of Promo WLP primer 240 SWC 19.0 grains H110 WLP primer 310 FN cast 15.0 grains of H110 WLP These all shoot incredibly well out of my Flat Top Bisley. 44 Special is a Dandy of a cartridge and well worth the effort to find a load that works in your gun.  |
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