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Post by nvcaller on Jun 21, 2019 9:11:39 GMT -5
My question is for elk hunting bullet choice , in 45 Colt? Some say hard cast with a large melplate some recommend 300gr jhp . My question is how effective is the hard cast for hunting with good shot placement , given it doesn't expand will a animal expire as fast as a expanding bullet. Also recommended bullet weight , and velocity standard. I shoot 315gr and 260gr bullets 315 at 1330 and 260 at 1100 for accuracy.
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Post by leftysixgun on Jun 21, 2019 10:17:31 GMT -5
I have ZERO experience with elk, so Im curious to see the responses. If you dont cast, take a look at GT bullets. They make several nice cast hollow points. Cast HP would be the path I would take.
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Post by taffin on Jun 21, 2019 11:59:50 GMT -5
My question is for elk hunting bullet choice , in 45 Colt? Some say hard cast with a large melplate some recommend 300gr jhp . My question is how effective is the hard cast for hunting with good shot placement , given it doesn't expand will a animal expire as fast as a expanding bullet. Also recommended bullet weight , and velocity standard. I shoot 315gr and 260gr bullets 315 at 1330 and 260 at 1100 for accuracy. I HAVE TAKEN THREE ELK AND THREE BISON ALL WITH HEAVY HARD CAST .45 OR .475 BULLETS; TWO FERAL PIGS OVER 500# EACH WITH KEITH LOAD .44 SPECIAL. ONE SHOT DOES IT. WHEN I GO FOR WHITETAILS, COUGAR ETC II USE A 240 JHP .44 MAGNUM
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Post by nvcaller on Jun 21, 2019 12:08:50 GMT -5
Thank you for your response the Keith load is 44 260 at 1300 isn't it? And did you get complete penatration? Was it thru the shoulder or arrow style shot behind the leg lung, liver hit? Was the blood tail easy to follow.
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Post by coldtriggerfinger on Jun 21, 2019 15:36:37 GMT -5
The primary thing is to put the bullet or boolit in the correct spot. Rarely at these velocities does a bullet or boolit blow up. Tho they may loose some weight. Before the heavy , hard cast revolution made those boolits available for retail in remote areas. I loaded and trusted Hornady and Speer 300 gr bullets in my 44 mags and 45 Colt. And 400 gr plated Speer bullets in my 480 Ruger. Now I cast my own boolits and consider them of equal utility. Imho, practice practice practice so you can easily put your 315 gr boolit exactly where you want. And you will be putting meat in the freezer.
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Post by azshaun on Jun 21, 2019 15:44:07 GMT -5
If you have never read Paco, I recommend his article here where he goes in depth on the subject: leverguns.com/articles/paco/why.htmI am still learning, but as I have been told before they worked before JHPs were so popular so no reason to think they wouldn’t now... Good friend uses jhp in his 41 mag not because solids don’t work, but because the animals don’t tend to run as long. I haven’t had a chance to prove to myself the truth in his statement.
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Post by boolitdesigner on Jun 21, 2019 16:20:04 GMT -5
If you have never read Paco, I recommend his article here where he goes in depth on the subject: leverguns.com/articles/paco/why.htm Excellent articleI am still learning, but as I have been told before they worked before JHPs were so popular so no reason to think they wouldn’t now... They do...........Good friend uses jhp in his 41 mag not because solids don’t work, but because the animals don’t tend to run as long. I haven’t had a chance to prove to myself the truth in his statement. Both statements are very true provided you use the right thing in the right place.
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Post by taffin on Jun 21, 2019 16:56:49 GMT -5
Thank you for your response the Keith load is 44 260 at 1300 isn't it? And did you get complete penatration? Was it thru the shoulder or arrow style shot behind the leg lung, liver hit? Was the blood tail easy to follow. KEITH LOAD IS 1200 FPS FROM A 7-1/2". I USED CAST HPs.SHOULDER SHOTS. TOTAL PENETRATION ON THE SMALLER 500# FERAL HOG; MUSHROOMED UNDER THE OFFSIDE HIDE ON THE 650# POUNDER. THERE IS NO BLOOD TRAIL TO FOLLOW--THEY DON'T GO ANYWHERE.
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Post by sixshot on Jun 21, 2019 20:17:36 GMT -5
I actually see 2 questions, the first one, how effective is the 45 with cast & good shot placement. It's excellent in my experience, I've taken 4 elk with the 45, one using the 260 gr Keith & 3 using the 325 gr LBT. All were solids except one & none of the elk covered more than 15-20 yds. As for using expanding bullets, I've never used an expanding 45 slug on elk so I can't help you there. Using HP's on elk can be a little tricky depending on location, if it's through the lungs with a big for caliber bullet I don'think you would have any problem but to me elk are very, very tough so choose your bullets wisely. I've taken 5 elk with 44 magnums, 2 with the 41 magnum & one last year with the Bisley 480 & it was my only elk ever taken with a HP, a 385 gr HP that simply overwhelmed her. None of the elk were ever shot twice. One of those taken with the 44 magnum was taken with a Speer 270 gr Gold Dot, same results as all the others. Shot placement & quality bullets will get you there. I've never recovered a bullet from any of my elk. My alloys usually run about 9-13 BHN & 1100-1300 fps. I never shoot what is considered a hard cast bullet.
Dick
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Post by coldtriggerfinger on Jun 21, 2019 20:49:36 GMT -5
That's a good article by Paco Kelly . Bit I disagree with his premise of the 350 gr Hornady 458 bullet out of a 458 Win mag. Its a terrible bullet IME. It would be an absolute last resort for me to shoot anything but paper with that bullet. I've about tore deer in half with that bullet from my 458s. Just made a terrible mess. Where as the 350 gr Speer small flatnose 458 bullet @ 2550 fps mv just pokes a 2" or less hole thru a Sitka Blacktail. With little to no radiating blood shock. I've killed a bunch of deer with the 458. And more with the 416 Taylor and Remington . Generally they run from 10 to 30 yards. But those same loads will knock a brown bear deflated flat. ! Almost always bang flop. And that's with bears that have their adrenalin up. With thoracic cavity shots. Now a 300 gr Barnes X or TSX@ 2700 fps mv is a fast deer killer and bear killer. But u have to be careful to only hit head , high neck or ribs only on a deer. It will excavate everything on the far side of a fast 300 X/TSX 458 bullet. Sorry I wandered off topic! I'm really looking fwd to hunting with my 45 Colt , Ruger Bisley with the solid, cup nose and deep hollow nose Mihec 45 Ruger max boolits. And comparing the results to my 480 Ruger with different boolits.
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Post by nvcaller on Jun 21, 2019 20:55:28 GMT -5
Nice article by Paco I never read that one . I have a Rossi 92 lol thanks to reading his articles in the past. I have killed 5 elk archery , 10 with rifle more than 20 deer but have never used a pistol . Most elk even with rifle have not been shot over 75 yrds. I just want to use a pistol and do right by my pray fast and clean. I shoot a lot so practice is not a problem. I have tracked and recovered freinds animals over 1 mile even archey mine have never covered over 150 yrds. Heart most is 75 lung 125 liver 100yrds averaging. My father killed a brown with his bow at 70yrs old hitting the aorta didn't go 20 yrds.just doing my home work thanks for the advice, so elk 260 or 315 as far as weight or does it really make a difference.
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Post by nvcaller on Jun 26, 2019 7:15:35 GMT -5
So for hard cast bullets is it the mass 260 vs 315 or velocity above 1000fps that makes the penetration difference. Or is there a velocity sweat spot 1000 to 1300, or 1300 to 1700 like the 454?
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Post by contender on Jun 26, 2019 8:26:51 GMT -5
I am currently planning a cow elk hunt for this fall. My plan is to use a cast solid, 45 cal. Miha bullet, in 285 solid, powder coated. I'd have to go & double check the recorded velocity,, but I'm very confident, that if I do my part,, I'll be enjoying elk steaks after the shot. I'm thinking my velocity is in the 1100 fps range,, but I'd have to double check it.
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Post by leftysixgun on Jun 26, 2019 9:29:57 GMT -5
So for hard cast bullets is it the mass 260 vs 315 or velocity above 1000fps that makes the penetration difference. Or is there a velocity sweat spot 1000 to 1300, or 1300 to 1700 like the 454? In my opinion is more about the mass than velocity. If it were me Id go with the 315gr and push it accurately up to 1200. If it falls short of that 1200fps mark but is still accurate....roll with it and practice practice practice.
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Post by coldtriggerfinger on Jun 26, 2019 11:53:38 GMT -5
If you hit well with your 315 gr load @ 1300 + fps. That is the load I would use. The Buffalo Bore 45 Colt ammo I've packed in 45 Colts for Bear Protection . Pushed a 325 gr hard cast flat nose @ 1325 fps. It was/is a good load . I've pretty much duplicated it with the Ruger Max , Miha mold in solid form . Pushed by 24 gr H110. Max book load. Its a very good load imho.
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