|
Post by tradmark on Jun 14, 2019 22:49:39 GMT -5
Not discounted, but taken within its limits. Not much hunting experience is not much hunting experience. Feedback is accurate as the one giving it. Obviously ignored much of the poor feedback of cast bullets and ignored some of the biggest bullet advancements if the last 30years. Nothing more nothing less.
|
|
|
Post by sixshot on Jun 15, 2019 20:00:08 GMT -5
Been gone for a week, got home at 2am this morning. This is a good subject with many good shooters/hunters jumping in so I think it will go on for a while. Myself, I don't think there is such a thing as a bad cast bullet but I do think there are bad choices. For many years I have been suggesting that people just might be better off if they would do 2 things with cast bullets. One is, slow them down a bit & the other is soften them a bit. Usually good things happen when you do both. A hard bullet at high velocity is a potential disaster. Hit big, hard bone (or steel) & they can shatter, soften them a bit & slow them a bit & many times you will get better results. You don't go jogging in combat boots & you don't hunt Brown Bears in Alaska wearing Tennis shoes, it's all about match ups, same with bullets. Depending on bullet placement even a some what softer alloy can easily take out both shoulders of animals up to elk size, I've done it multiple times. Go to the heavyweight HP's & it's still possible if you don't run at top end velocity, I've done it multiple times. The biggest argument comes when the animals get oversize, make it simple, match the bullet to the animal, buy the best bullet you can get, it's a cheap price to pay when there's a 30.000 hunt riding on one shot, use a Swift A Frame or other Solid jacketed bullet & never look back. But the other 95% of the time a good cast bullet, either solid or HP will get you to the promised land if your shooting is as good as it should be. Just punch them through the shoulders or lungs, then punch your tag. Oh, and bring some salt & pepper.....
Dick
|
|
|
Post by leftysixgun on Jun 15, 2019 21:19:48 GMT -5
Been gone for a week, got home at 2am this morning. This is a good subject with many good shooters/hunters jumping in so I think it will go on for a while. Myself, I don't think there is such a thing as a bad cast bullet but I do think there are bad choices. For many years I have been suggesting that people just might be better off if they would do 2 things with cast bullets. One is, slow them down a bit & the other is soften them a bit. Usually good things happen when you do both. A hard bullet at high velocity is a potential disaster. Hit big, hard bone (or steel) & they can shatter, soften them a bit & slow them a bit & many times you will get better results. You don't go jogging in combat boots & you don't hunt Brown Bears in Alaska wearing Tennis shoes, it's all about match ups, same with bullets. Depending on bullet placement even a some what softer alloy can easily take out both shoulders of animals up to elk size, I've done it multiple times. Go to the heavyweight HP's & it's still possible if you don't run at top end velocity, I've done it multiple times. The biggest argument comes when the animals get oversize, make it simple, match the bullet to the animal, buy the best bullet you can get, it's a cheap price to pay when there's a 30.000 hunt riding on one shot, use a Swift A Frame or other Solid jacketed bullet & never look back. But the other 95% of the time a good cast bullet, either solid or HP will get you to the promised land if your shooting is as good as it should be. Just punch them through the shoulders or lungs, then punch your tag. Oh, and bring some salt & pepper..... Dick Hahaha, I like it! Nice post Dick, it makes sense.
|
|
|
Post by bradshaw on Jun 16, 2019 6:57:07 GMT -5
About two decades ago John Linebaugh handed me a round to try in a Ruger .500 Linebaugh he built for his pal, a fine knifemaker by the handle Jerry Halfrich (and, in an earlier life, a Powder Monkey). I loaded the 420 grain Long Flat Nose brass solid into the 5-shooter, blew up a chunk of mesquite, and planted the bullet into Texas caliche, the native limestone or yellow sedimentary rock which, exposed to sun, water and weather at the surface of the Earth, eventually crumbles into tough, gravelly soil. If you’ve ever tried to dig caliche with a shovel, you know what I’m talking about. The object of this exercise was to recover the bullet.... the bullet hadn’t penetrated much; John dug it out and handed it too me.
The “solid” brass .510 bullet----there is a photo of it somewhere in my photo essay series----shows slight abrasion of the sharp Long Flat Nose (LFN). The knurled skirt, a.k.a. “wheelbase” as the Rugers referred to bearing surface, shows shallow, uniform engraving of the rifling. I think this is a variation of the original Punch Bullet. A small cavity in the base contains lead, presumably to satisfy regulations.... while I count the added density in the base as a plus for shifting the Center of Gravity slightly rearward to increase distance from Center of Form, thus to enhance stability in air and in target. (This last consideration may be irrelevant, as the Long Flat Nose is a stable design.)
I asked John the purpose of this Punch Bullet. “To stay together against bones in really big stuff,” he said. “Driven hard in the big stuff, a lead bullet can come apart.” David Bradshaw
|
|
|
Post by 2 Dogs on Jul 6, 2019 9:36:25 GMT -5
Again, I have never shot a Cape Buff, never been in a phone booth with a hungry African Lion, never tried to steal a Grizz cub from the Momma Grizz, BUT I have been really close to a person who had every opportunity to put me or another down for good and I certainly wasn't looking for any "bone breaking or full penetration" shots. I was looking to plant one in the center of that skull from whatever angle I was at. Now as I see it from my limited point of view you have 2 problems: First is the lack of time and the second would be fact that bullets tend to skip off a critters skull. Simple fact, SKULLS ARE HARD! But still if I came out not gored, not scratched (Don't Lions more CLEAVE than scratch?), not pounded into hamburger or chopped with a machete or whatever because I bounced a bullet off some critter and either killed or even distracted or knocked down or made him otherwise dizzy or distracted so I could make me some distance and safe where I could shoot some more and maybe even some more that would be very good.....But what do I know?
But back to the 475/480/385, there seems to be almost a perfect combination hardness, speed, shank, penetration capability, expansion, weight retention, etc where you have a symphony of performance that is hard to beat.
|
|
|
Post by 2 Dogs on Jul 6, 2019 9:39:03 GMT -5
I do think there is not much NEED for velocity over 1200fps if you’re using a medium weight bullet in North America. Given 1200fps, you can choose between a monometal deep penetrating bullet, a controlled expansion HP/SP, or something like Fermin describes that has a nose that shreds and a shank that penetrates, I mean that’s basically a Nosler Partition. Choose your bullet to match your game or performance desires and go hunt. Fermin, as for following pigs into S. Texas brush, I’ve been on hands and knees following blood trails from Cotulla and Three Rivers to Kingsville and Laredo I’ve never once crawled into a rattlebug, but I have come out covered in fleas!!!! Trapr Trapr, PM you email address. I have a picture that will change your mind.
|
|
|
Post by bigbrowndog on Jul 6, 2019 14:12:56 GMT -5
About speed or crawling around on blood trails???
Trapr
|
|
|
Post by leftysixgun on Jul 6, 2019 18:38:40 GMT -5
I do think there is not much NEED for velocity over 1200fps if you’re using a medium weight bullet in North America. Given 1200fps, you can choose between a monometal deep penetrating bullet, a controlled expansion HP/SP, or something like Fermin describes that has a nose that shreds and a shank that penetrates, I mean that’s basically a Nosler Partition. Choose your bullet to match your game or performance desires and go hunt. Fermin, as for following pigs into S. Texas brush, I’ve been on hands and knees following blood trails from Cotulla and Three Rivers to Kingsville and Laredo I’ve never once crawled into a rattlebug, but I have come out covered in fleas!!!! Trapr Trapr, PM you email address. I have a picture that will change your mind. Id like to see the said picture please.
|
|
|
Post by bigbrowndog on Jul 6, 2019 19:42:39 GMT -5
Trapr, PM you email address. I have a picture that will change your mind. Id like to see the said picture please. Lefty, I ain’t seen it yet!!! trapr
|
|